question for 8 track folks:

BTW, why do people on this list collect these things in the first place? I
love music, but I can't stand record companies that want to charge me 20
bucks for some long dead band (and I mean dead, as in deceased) that won't
(nor couldn't) see a dime of the money anyhow -- and I don't much care for
downloading stuff that IMHO should be in public domain by now anyhow.
Regardless, there is a lot of good music out there that can be found on
"dead" formats.

darnoc

On Tue, 21 Mar 2006 23:06:08 -0500, "darnoc"
wrote:

BTW, why do people on this list collect these things in the first place? I
love music, but I can't stand record companies that want to charge me 20
bucks for some long dead band (and I mean dead, as in deceased) that won't
(nor couldn't) see a dime of the money anyhow -- and I don't much care for
downloading stuff that IMHO should be in public domain by now anyhow.
Regardless, there is a lot of good music out there that can be found on
"dead" formats. snip

"IMHO" doesn't cut the legal argument used in copyright laws...sorry.

You are correct about using "dead" formats as usable music sources. 8
track is, at best, a "mid-fi" format, but is quite usable enough to
prevent you from spending $25 for a badly mastered CD of the same
album. Hence, if you are technically proficient, and spend time to
learn a bit about how analog tape really works, you can get some good
results. However, be advised: About 35% of the 8 track tapes I've
gotten from a variety of sources are magnetized and/or partially
erased due to poor deck maintenance, and thus, aren't really
listenable to the critical ear...most of the top end will be gone, and
in extreme cases, distortion on peaks will be unlistenable. Other
problems, such as "crinkled" tape, spalling graphite backcoating, bad
pressure pads (a certainty) and "melted" pinch rollers, are just a
fact of life with this obsolete format.

In short, when compared to later cassettes, they are a pain in the
ass, which is why the format went away finally in 1988. Although
initially better than early cassettes aurally, later high speed
ferrichrome dupe processes gave full range frequency response with
well done Dolby encoding and lower noise floors. Thus, the oft-heard
claim that 8 track is always superior to cassette due to its higher
speed just doesn't ring true on any prerecorded cassette sold after
about 1981. This isn't to say that used cassettes aren't trashed
either...many are. But my experience has been that used cassettes,
which can be had for sometimes 50¢ a shot, are a better bet on quality
than most 8 tracks you get on eBay. There, with the market being
boosted by opportunistic eBay hustlers desperate to make a dime, the
return on investment is getting thinner all the time for the buyer. 8
tracks that used to routinely go for the traditional 99¢ on eBay are
now being hustled for $3 and more. It just doesn't make sense to buy
at that price, unless it's something you REALLY want in your
collection that's unobtainable in other formats...which is sometimes
the case.

Thus, if you're only in it for the music, skip the 8 tracks and
collect later cassette. If you're in it for the "fun" of tinkering
and fixing, 8 track's lots of "fun." I find myself increasly just
dubbing the material off of usable 8 tracks into PCM files, from which
I can burn CD-Rs to use in the car and at home. Use of ProTools
allows me to "dehiss" these to a degree, as well as compensate for
poor high frequency response and add judicious expansion. I've
already just about given up using 8 tracks in the one remaining
vehicle so equipped...the maintenance just isn't worth my time
anymore.

dB

darnoc wrote:
BTW, why do people on this list collect these things in the first place? I
love music, but I can't stand record companies that want to charge me 20
bucks for some long dead band (and I mean dead, as in deceased) that won't
(nor couldn't) see a dime of the money anyhow -- and I don't much care for
downloading stuff that IMHO should be in public domain by now anyhow.
Regardless, there is a lot of good music out there that can be found on
"dead" formats.

darnoc


I collect them because I can find unique stuff that you can't find
anywhere else for a really cheap price or free. All of my players were
free except for one that cost me $5.00. I know they weren't the best
format ever and don't have the best sound quality, but there is a lot of
unique stuff that I enjoy listening to, but I wouldn't go and pay the
price to have it on a Cd, so this gives me a chance to sample bands that
I never got into back in the day like Deep Purple, Cream, J. Geils Band
and many others. Hope this helps you to understand.

Scott Irvine

I totally agree. I got a collection of 120 8-tracks from eBay for like 20
bucks a couple of weeks ago (most were complete. .. ahem ****e). However,
out of it was about 17 really good carts. The Willie Nelson and Leon
Russell cart really made me feel good about the purchase -- besides the
bizarre stuff you wouldn't bother with otherwise. Like I said. I love
music. My darkest day was when Big Lots stopped carrying cassettes -- BB
King and Bobby Bland Live, where you gonna find that for 3 bucks new?
Anyway, great stuff can be neither new, expensive, nor well known.



"Scott Irvine" wrote in message
news:G96Uf.43499$oL.21191@attbi_s71...
darnoc wrote:
BTW, why do people on this list collect these things in the first place?
I love music, but I can't stand record companies that want to charge me
20 bucks for some long dead band (and I mean dead, as in deceased) that
won't (nor couldn't) see a dime of the money anyhow -- and I don't much
care for downloading stuff that IMHO should be in public domain by now
anyhow. Regardless, there is a lot of good music out there that can be
found on "dead" formats.

darnoc


I collect them because I can find unique stuff that you can't find
anywhere else for a really cheap price or free. All of my players were
free except for one that cost me $5.00. I know they weren't the best
format ever and don't have the best sound quality, but there is a lot of
unique stuff that I enjoy listening to, but I wouldn't go and pay the
price to have it on a Cd, so this gives me a chance to sample bands that I
never got into back in the day like Deep Purple, Cream, J. Geils Band and
many others. Hope this helps you to understand.

Scott Irvine

Like I said, just MHO. no more, no less I don't sell ****, and I don't
skirt the law. But I've found such good things over the years. -- and I
will continue to do so. I really want to get into Reel to Reel. Not the
right forum, but I've heard good things about the pioneer decks -- but the
price seems prohibitive lately. The Akai gx-4000D looks like a good bet for
under 200? Is it possible to get a "decent" reel to reel under 200 bucks
these days? I have lots of personal contacts with these tapes just setting
on their shelves.












"DeserTBoB" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 21 Mar 2006 23:06:08 -0500, "darnoc"
wrote:

BTW, why do people on this list collect these things in the first place?
I
love music, but I can't stand record companies that want to charge me 20
bucks for some long dead band (and I mean dead, as in deceased) that won't
(nor couldn't) see a dime of the money anyhow -- and I don't much care for
downloading stuff that IMHO should be in public domain by now anyhow.
Regardless, there is a lot of good music out there that can be found on
"dead" formats. snip

"IMHO" doesn't cut the legal argument used in copyright laws...sorry.

You are correct about using "dead" formats as usable music sources. 8
track is, at best, a "mid-fi" format, but is quite usable enough to
prevent you from spending $25 for a badly mastered CD of the same
album. Hence, if you are technically proficient, and spend time to
learn a bit about how analog tape really works, you can get some good
results. However, be advised: About 35% of the 8 track tapes I've
gotten from a variety of sources are magnetized and/or partially
erased due to poor deck maintenance, and thus, aren't really
listenable to the critical ear...most of the top end will be gone, and
in extreme cases, distortion on peaks will be unlistenable. Other
problems, such as "crinkled" tape, spalling graphite backcoating, bad
pressure pads (a certainty) and "melted" pinch rollers, are just a
fact of life with this obsolete format.

In short, when compared to later cassettes, they are a pain in the
ass, which is why the format went away finally in 1988. Although
initially better than early cassettes aurally, later high speed
ferrichrome dupe processes gave full range frequency response with
well done Dolby encoding and lower noise floors. Thus, the oft-heard
claim that 8 track is always superior to cassette due to its higher
speed just doesn't ring true on any prerecorded cassette sold after
about 1981. This isn't to say that used cassettes aren't trashed
either...many are. But my experience has been that used cassettes,
which can be had for sometimes 50¢ a shot, are a better bet on quality
than most 8 tracks you get on eBay. There, with the market being
boosted by opportunistic eBay hustlers desperate to make a dime, the
return on investment is getting thinner all the time for the buyer. 8
tracks that used to routinely go for the traditional 99¢ on eBay are
now being hustled for $3 and more. It just doesn't make sense to buy
at that price, unless it's something you REALLY want in your
collection that's unobtainable in other formats...which is sometimes
the case.

Thus, if you're only in it for the music, skip the 8 tracks and
collect later cassette. If you're in it for the "fun" of tinkering
and fixing, 8 track's lots of "fun." I find myself increasly just
dubbing the material off of usable 8 tracks into PCM files, from which
I can burn CD-Rs to use in the car and at home. Use of ProTools
allows me to "dehiss" these to a degree, as well as compensate for
poor high frequency response and add judicious expansion. I've
already just about given up using 8 tracks in the one remaining
vehicle so equipped...the maintenance just isn't worth my time
anymore.

dB

you hit the nail- for years I've been getting lots of 300-400 tapes
from the local thrifties for 20 cents each. The flea markets are
better yet, where you can buy an entire stand out for a dime a tape.

Why pay $15-25 per CD at Walmart or Best Buy ? The 8-tracks actually
sound BETTER, through a high end tube amp and player.

That's the problem- people have stuck in their head that 8-tracks
"should" sound bad. The reason being, back in the day the splices
always broke.

you hit the nail- for years I've been getting lots of 300-400 tapes
from the local thrifties for 20 cents each. The flea markets are
better yet, where you can buy an entire stand out for a dime a tape.

Why pay $15-25 per CD at Walmart or Best Buy ? The 8-tracks actually
sound BETTER, through a high end tube amp and player.

That's the problem- people have stuck in their head that 8-tracks
"should" sound bad. The reason being, back in the day the splices
always broke.

On Wed, 22 Mar 2006 05:00:19 -0500, "darnoc"
wrote:

Like I said, just MHO. no more, no less I don't sell ****, and I don't
skirt the law. But I've found such good things over the years. -- and I
will continue to do so. I really want to get into Reel to Reel. Not the
right forum, but I've heard good things about the pioneer decks -- but the
price seems prohibitive lately. The Akai gx-4000D looks like a good bet for
under 200? Is it possible to get a "decent" reel to reel under 200 bucks
these days? I have lots of personal contacts with these tapes just setting
on their shelves. snip

Getting a "decent RTR for under $200" is sort of like buying a
"reliable car for under $200"...they don't really exist. If you're
serious about RTR, get a three motor, 4 track format machine. Auto
reverse is optional on your part. For reliability, the Teacs were
pretty good, although their electronics were fairly noisy, and not all
that good for recording. I think the Pioneers are way overpriced, as
they weren't that good a machine when new. The big three motor Akais
were pretty good machines, better than the single motored 1700 and
1800 series with the built in 8 track...those sort of suck. For
consumer RTR, it was pretty hard to beat the Teacs for reliability, if
not sonic quality. Teacs didn't make very good recorders; their
record amps were somewhat wimpy and couldn't do 250 nWb/m, but for
home use, they were OK. Stay WAY away from Dokorders and Sonys...two
of the worst RTRs every sold.

dB

On 22 Mar 2006 02:38:42 -0800, "duty-honor-country"
wrote:

Why pay $15-25 per CD at Walmart or Best Buy ? The 8-tracks actually
sound BETTER, through a high end tube amp and player. snip

BWAAAAAAAAAAAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

That's the problem- people have stuck in their head that 8-tracks
"should" sound bad. The reason being, back in the day the splices
always broke. snip

There's a LOTmore to it than what this simpleton is saying, but you
can't expect anything more from Charlie Nudo, our resident 'tard.

Hey Noodles! How's your Power Smeller status lately?

BWAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHA!

On 22 Mar 2006 02:38:53 -0800, "duty-honor-country"
wrote:

you hit the nail- for years I've been getting lots of 300-400 tapes
from the local thrifties for 20 cents each. The flea markets are
better yet, where you can buy an entire stand out for a dime a tape.

Why pay $15-25 per CD at Walmart or Best Buy ? The 8-tracks actually
sound BETTER, through a high end tube amp and player.

That's the problem- people have stuck in their head that 8-tracks
"should" sound bad. The reason being, back in the day the splices
always broke. snip

Hey Noodles....you're making more work for yourself! After all,
you'll get scared later today and delete your posts again!

RUNNNNNNNNNNNNN, Noodles....RUNNNNNNNNNNNNN!