Plagerism

I have noticed that you get quite a lot of posts on the subject of plagerism
on this newsgroup. Ebay sellers like me seem to get the most stick for
stealing other peoples descriptions of books. Are not dealers on Addall and
Abe not commiting pagerism. They take the description from the jacket and
copy it word for word. If I then copy and paste what they have copied (still
following this ?) does that make me any worse than them ?
Best regards
Diane
http://members.ebay.com/aboutme/romford2415/

"diane.walker" wrote in message
...
I have noticed that you get quite a lot of posts on the subject of
plagerism
on this newsgroup. Ebay sellers like me seem to get the most stick for
stealing other peoples descriptions of books. Are not dealers on Addall
and
Abe not commiting pagerism. They take the description from the jacket and
copy it word for word. If I then copy and paste what they have copied
(still
following this ?) does that make me any worse than them ?
Best regards

Well, for one thing it is spelled "plagiarism", not "plagerism" or
"pagerism" (would that be stealing someone's pager or the worship of pagers
or, dare I say it, the worship of Paghat?)

--
Bob Finnan
The Hardy Boys Unofficial Home Page
http://www.Hardy-Boys.net
New & Out Of Print Books, Books-On-Tape, Videos, DVDs, CD-ROMs For Sale
http://users.arczip.com/fwdixon/hbsale.htm
To reply: replace spamless with fwdixon
.................................................. ....................

"diane.walker" sez:

I have noticed that you get quite a lot of posts on the subject of plagerism
on this newsgroup.

No. We do, in fact, post quite a bit about "plagiarism," but someone
who can't be bothered to know the correct spelling of the term
probably wouldn't be above stealing descriptions from better and more
knowledgeable booksellers than themselves.

Ebay sellers like me seem to get the most stick for
stealing other peoples descriptions of books. Are not dealers on Addall and
Abe not commiting pagerism. They take the description from the jacket and
copy it word for word. If I then copy and paste what they have copied (still
following this ?) does that make me any worse than them ?

It certainly makes you just as bad. But along with your ignorance of
spelling, you're also apparently ignorant of our specific complaint:
that a description we've written based on years of research and
knowledge is ripped off wholesale and used by some eBay yobbo (like
yourself) who a) wouldn't know a book from a doorstop, b) doesn't care
if the description doesn't adequately fit the particular copy you're
hoping to flog to some poor meathead with more money than sense,
and/or c) tries desperately to justify her actions by shoving the
blame onto the booksellers who quote from blurbs, WHICH IS THEIR
ENTIRE PURPOSE.

A blurb ain't a description, Ms. Walker, and if you had a lick of
book-sense you'd already know that.



You want free speech? Let's see you acknowledge a man
whose words make your blood boil, who's standing
center stage and advocating at the top of his lungs
that which you would spend a lifetime opposing at the
top of yours.
- "The American President"

"Denise Enck" wrote in message
thlink.net...

Also consider that when you use another person's words without permission,
you are violating their copyright. ALL published works (whether in print
or
on the internet, whether registered with the copyright office or not, and
whether they are accompanied by a copyright statement or not) are
copyrighted. If you want to use another person's words in your description
of a book, it would not be enough to credit them, you must also obtain
their
permission.


A couple of incorrect generalizations he

(1) Not everything published is copyrighted: there are millions and millions
of works in the public domain.

(2) It is not always necessary to obtain permission to use copyrighted
material: one example would be fair use.


I've thought about this before and I would argue that there is an implied
license to use the material on the dust jacket or cover of a book--the
author/publisher retains the copyright of that blurbage, but they understand
that booksellers, inter al., are going to use that material to sell the book
or for other purposes (e.g., cataloging, etc.).


William M. Klimon
http://www.gateofbliss.com

Oh deary me, not only am I an ignorant ebay yobbo, but I can't spell either!
Many thanks to everybody who has taken the time to add to this string - I
have learnt a lot, not least how to spell "plagiarism"!( are you sure that's
spelt right?!)
Most thanks have to go to the eloquent Mr Bud Webster - I have to say I'd
hate to meet you on a dark night! Still, I bear you no ill-feeling Mr
Webster, even if you wish a bolt of lightning to strike me dead, judging by
the venomous tone of your posting! I thought this was supposed to be a
newsgroup where we could discuss and advise as adults, I never expected to
get such an aggressive response as that! Does this mean that you won't be
buying any of my books in the future?
All the best,
Diane "yobbo" Walker
Every day I get confused - um bah, the magic bus
- "The Who"

"Bud Webster" wrote in message
...
"diane.walker" sez:

I have noticed that you get quite a lot of posts on the subject of
plagerism
on this newsgroup.

No. We do, in fact, post quite a bit about "plagiarism," but someone
who can't be bothered to know the correct spelling of the term
probably wouldn't be above stealing descriptions from better and more
knowledgeable booksellers than themselves.

Ebay sellers like me seem to get the most stick for
stealing other peoples descriptions of books. Are not dealers on Addall
and
Abe not commiting pagerism. They take the description from the jacket and
copy it word for word. If I then copy and paste what they have copied
(still
following this ?) does that make me any worse than them ?

It certainly makes you just as bad. But along with your ignorance of
spelling, you're also apparently ignorant of our specific complaint:
that a description we've written based on years of research and
knowledge is ripped off wholesale and used by some eBay yobbo (like
yourself) who a) wouldn't know a book from a doorstop, b) doesn't care
if the description doesn't adequately fit the particular copy you're
hoping to flog to some poor meathead with more money than sense,
and/or c) tries desperately to justify her actions by shoving the
blame onto the booksellers who quote from blurbs, WHICH IS THEIR
ENTIRE PURPOSE.

A blurb ain't a description, Ms. Walker, and if you had a lick of
book-sense you'd already know that.



You want free speech? Let's see you acknowledge a man
whose words make your blood boil, who's standing
center stage and advocating at the top of his lungs
that which you would spend a lifetime opposing at the
top of yours.
- "The American President"

On Sat, 26 Jul 2003 19:14:40 -0700, Bud Webster
declared:

(Jerry Morris) sez:


Now, I'm waiting to see if she jumps all over YOUR shirt!

*shrug* She tried. I see no blood, so I assume she missed.

Jerry, she was trying to justify *plagiarism.* How by you is that
correct and defensible?


i think that she was unclear. to my re-reading the question was if
she cuts and pastes someones typing of the dj copy, is she as bad as
those who cut and pastes someones entire description (whether it
includes dj copy or not).

my answer is no, as long as the copy is exactly the same as what is
written on the dj.


robert

"I've been long, a long way from here
Put on a poncho, played for mosquitos,
And drank til I was thirsty again
We went searching through thrift store jungles
Found Geronimo's rifle, Marilyn's shampoo
And Benny Goodman's corset and pen"

"William M. Klimon" wrote in message
news:XpBUa.5231$5b7.1298@lakeread01...
"Denise Enck" wrote in message
thlink.net...

Also consider that when you use another person's words without
permission,
you are violating their copyright. ALL published works (whether in print
or
on the internet, whether registered with the copyright office or not,
and
whether they are accompanied by a copyright statement or not) are
copyrighted. If you want to use another person's words in your
description
of a book, it would not be enough to credit them, you must also obtain
their
permission.


A couple of incorrect generalizations he

(1) Not everything published is copyrighted: there are millions and
millions
of works in the public domain.

(2) It is not always necessary to obtain permission to use copyrighted
material: one example would be fair use.


I've thought about this before and I would argue that there is an implied
license to use the material on the dust jacket or cover of a book--the
author/publisher retains the copyright of that blurbage, but they
understand
that booksellers, inter al., are going to use that material to sell the
book
or for other purposes (e.g., cataloging, etc.).


William M. Klimon
http://www.gateofbliss.com


Hi William,

I did mention fair use in my earlier post - just read a bit past the part
you quoted.

Yes, many works are in the public domain. When I wrote the post I was
thinking about book listings & information that booksellers have written
about books on the internet - what the original poster was asking about. I
should have been more explicit. But anything that is published today -
whether on the internet or otherwise - is indeed copyrighted.

best,
Denise

(Jerry Morris) sez:


Now, I'm waiting to see if she jumps all over YOUR shirt!

*shrug* She tried. I see no blood, so I assume she missed.

Jerry, she was trying to justify *plagiarism.* How by you is that
correct and defensible?


You want free speech? Let's see you acknowledge a man
whose words make your blood boil, who's standing
center stage and advocating at the top of his lungs
that which you would spend a lifetime opposing at the
top of yours.
- "The American President"

R. Totale sez:

Hey, that's "Every day I get in the queue".

But, you knew that. Just piling on...

No, I doubt she did. But you shouldn't have quoted her, she might
accuse you of "pagerism."



You want free speech? Let's see you acknowledge a man
whose words make your blood boil, who's standing
center stage and advocating at the top of his lungs
that which you would spend a lifetime opposing at the
top of yours.
- "The American President"

"fwdixon" wrote...
"diane.walker" wrote...
I have noticed that you get quite a lot of posts on the subject of
plagerism..

Well, for one thing it is spelled "plagiarism", not "plagerism" or
"pagerism" (would that be stealing someone's pager or the worship of
pagers
or, dare I say it, the worship of Paghat?)

Any St. Louisan would know that "Plagerism" is the worship of St. Louis
hockey legends Bob and Barclay Plager, Blues defensive stalwarts in the '60s
and '70s.


--
Jon Meyers
[To reply,
lose your way.]