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#21
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Exciting News
He needs to be watched to make sure he is knowledgable about what he's
doing and also for his motivations. So he should come forward. However, I am for his efforts in that there is only one down side to it for collectors (unless people who are selling legit stuff get booted without true proof). If all the forgeries were WIPED out on Ebay and we had a utopian society, we could be assured not go get ripped off, we would have less to look through but let's remember too, there would be less competition and so they could raise their prices. On Fri, 4 Nov 2005 18:14:05 -0600, "Gummby3" wrote: Mike, I can see Auto Cop's point of view. He, as well as others in his group, have stirred up a hornet's nest by pressing Ebay to, shocks of shocks, police themselves and not just rake in the money from each and every sale regardless of the contents. I would seriously think that AC's auctions are being put under a microscope each time a new entry is put up for sale. They don't want negative publicity by booting off forgers just to be conned by a forger themselves (not saying AC is one in the least... just an example). I don't see any reason for AC to "put his neck out" as he is being watched by a hawk to make sure that he is up and up. |
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#22
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Exciting News
Who are all these people involved? No one here was asked? And what
makes them experts? On Sat, 05 Nov 2005 00:15:27 GMT, "Auto Cop" wrote: Mike, O.K., first you annoyed me, then you angered me, now you're just making me laugh. You can say whatever you want about me, I simply don't care. Again, my stuff on eBay is just as available for scrutiny as every other sellers. If I were a forger and if I were not a recognized expert in my field and if I had any question about what I was selling I'd be an idiot to push for what I've been pushing for the last 5+ years. If you're too thick to understand that, I can't help you. The people involved in this effort are some of the most respected people in the field (dealers and collectors). For someone like you to cast aspersions on this group is quite humorous. Again, if you can't support the effort because you can't get your curiousity satisfied, then that's your prerogative. "barefoot" wrote in message roups.com... again, i'm not discounting his measures...in fact, he's preaching to the choir on this one...all i'm saying is that he should let HIS stuff be stood up and accounted for... there are plenty of people out there seing fake stuff that don't know it, and fight hard like he's claiming to do...only to be unknowingly selling bad stuff...his reluctance to state his seller name shows his fear that HE may be brought out too... and yes, i was suspended for unscrupuous behavior. but have been deemed worthy by the ewbay community once again. and i sign my name to everything, and i let anyone know exactly what i am selling... and i wish that by people pulling bad stuff off ebay would actually help (especially during the holidays since little kids buy autographs for dad and dad buys that michael vick auto his kid wants and neither knows they are buying fake stuff) that's besides the point...LET US KNOW WHO YOU ARE, JUDGE NOT LEST YE BE JUDGED! mike |
#23
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Exciting News
Again, Sue... you make great points. We have had many meetings with eBay
executives all throughout eBay - face to face, conference calls, email communications, etc. I want to stress that this has been a very, very long-term effort and we have put a lot of our own time and money into this. This has not all happened on a lark. We have worked extensively with eBay, we have always been polite and professional with them, they are very aware of our credentials, who we are, etc. This will not ever be allowed to be a "Wild West" type of thing where everyone is shooting at each other just to eliminate their competition. This thing is being built slowly, brick-by-brick, with much though and attention to detail. In fact, it's still very much a work in progress. We're very excited, though, that it's finally moving forward and that we're starting to see some results. "Sue H" wrote in message ... I do agree that Ebay shouldn't necessarily by one person's or one businesses "word" ... especially when they have no degree in authentication. We need to be a community and to do that, I also agree names should not be withheld. People need to work together. On the surface, it DOES appear that one can go to Ebay, say this and that is fake it COULD seem that they are dealers trying to boost their own name. Also, Ebay DOES need to check into them. For example, if I email them, I would most certainly like them to research me. See who I am, what I do, talk to me to find out my motivations. I would welcome that. Goodness often wins out, but usually after eons of being opressed. On 4 Nov 2005 16:06:00 -0800, "barefoot" wrote: again, i'm not discounting his measures...in fact, he's preaching to the choir on this one...all i'm saying is that he should let HIS stuff be stood up and accounted for... there are plenty of people out there seing fake stuff that don't know it, and fight hard like he's claiming to do...only to be unknowingly selling bad stuff...his reluctance to state his seller name shows his fear that HE may be brought out too... and yes, i was suspended for unscrupuous behavior. but have been deemed worthy by the ewbay community once again. and i sign my name to everything, and i let anyone know exactly what i am selling... and i wish that by people pulling bad stuff off ebay would actually help (especially during the holidays since little kids buy autographs for dad and dad buys that michael vick auto his kid wants and neither knows they are buying fake stuff) that's besides the point...LET US KNOW WHO YOU ARE, JUDGE NOT LEST YE BE JUDGED! mike |
#24
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Exciting News
Let me try again to make this clear. Yes, this is a small group of highly
reputable people. But no, we are not necessarily the ones who will be making the call. Our role has simply been to push eBay to start to deal with this problem. That is why who "we" are is not particularly relevent, unless you're one of the "bad guys". And, no one was "asked". This is something we've all just done. I hope this is getting though. Again, our role has simply been to press eBay on this issue. We're not actually ending auctions, etc. Seriously, some of you are just totally missing the point. "Sue H" wrote in message ... Who are all these people involved? No one here was asked? And what makes them experts? On Sat, 05 Nov 2005 00:15:27 GMT, "Auto Cop" wrote: Mike, O.K., first you annoyed me, then you angered me, now you're just making me laugh. You can say whatever you want about me, I simply don't care. Again, my stuff on eBay is just as available for scrutiny as every other sellers. If I were a forger and if I were not a recognized expert in my field and if I had any question about what I was selling I'd be an idiot to push for what I've been pushing for the last 5+ years. If you're too thick to understand that, I can't help you. The people involved in this effort are some of the most respected people in the field (dealers and collectors). For someone like you to cast aspersions on this group is quite humorous. Again, if you can't support the effort because you can't get your curiousity satisfied, then that's your prerogative. "barefoot" wrote in message groups.com... again, i'm not discounting his measures...in fact, he's preaching to the choir on this one...all i'm saying is that he should let HIS stuff be stood up and accounted for... there are plenty of people out there seing fake stuff that don't know it, and fight hard like he's claiming to do...only to be unknowingly selling bad stuff...his reluctance to state his seller name shows his fear that HE may be brought out too... and yes, i was suspended for unscrupuous behavior. but have been deemed worthy by the ewbay community once again. and i sign my name to everything, and i let anyone know exactly what i am selling... and i wish that by people pulling bad stuff off ebay would actually help (especially during the holidays since little kids buy autographs for dad and dad buys that michael vick auto his kid wants and neither knows they are buying fake stuff) that's besides the point...LET US KNOW WHO YOU ARE, JUDGE NOT LEST YE BE JUDGED! mike |
#25
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I don't want to bust anyone's bubble too badly but, I'm going to.
First, autographs are not the only area that has a lot of fakes and scams. Coins was one area where it was rampant. After years of pleading and sending evidence Ebay agreed to partner with the American Numismatic Association (ANA) and they were going to clean up the fakes, etc. After several years of being in bed with ANA exactly no auctions, except for the most blatant have been pulled. Every day 100s of fake coins are put up by Chinese sellers and these even have coins that were never minted in the US and some of these are going for big bucks to the uninformed. Basically if we bellyache enough about an auction they will take a look but say "we are just a venue and we aren't experts on this item". You can look forward to more of the same. No matter what someone has told you, it's not going to change. If ebay has a big power seller making them a whole lot of money selling fake autographs, unless they are pinned down by the FBI or Secret Service, they are not going to cut into their income source. Again, ebay is not an expert on anything. Stop your celebrating and get to living in the real world. Cliff On Fri, 04 Nov 2005 19:33:47 -0500, Sue H wrote: I do agree that Ebay shouldn't necessarily by one person's or one businesses "word" ... especially when they have no degree in authentication. We need to be a community and to do that, I also agree names should not be withheld. People need to work together. On the surface, it DOES appear that one can go to Ebay, say this and that is fake it COULD seem that they are dealers trying to boost their own name. Also, Ebay DOES need to check into them. For example, if I email them, I would most certainly like them to research me. See who I am, what I do, talk to me to find out my motivations. I would welcome that. Goodness often wins out, but usually after eons of being opressed. On 4 Nov 2005 16:06:00 -0800, "barefoot" wrote: again, i'm not discounting his measures...in fact, he's preaching to the choir on this one...all i'm saying is that he should let HIS stuff be stood up and accounted for... there are plenty of people out there seing fake stuff that don't know it, and fight hard like he's claiming to do...only to be unknowingly selling bad stuff...his reluctance to state his seller name shows his fear that HE may be brought out too... and yes, i was suspended for unscrupuous behavior. but have been deemed worthy by the ewbay community once again. and i sign my name to everything, and i let anyone know exactly what i am selling... and i wish that by people pulling bad stuff off ebay would actually help (especially during the holidays since little kids buy autographs for dad and dad buys that michael vick auto his kid wants and neither knows they are buying fake stuff) that's besides the point...LET US KNOW WHO YOU ARE, JUDGE NOT LEST YE BE JUDGED! mike |
#26
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Bottom line is you are dreaming. Ebay teamed with the ANA, the
largest organization representing coin collectors in this country, and nothing has changed. There is too much money for ebay to make. They are now and always will be "a venue". If you've gotten anything, you've gotten lipservice. Cliff On Sat, 05 Nov 2005 00:43:52 GMT, "Auto Cop" wrote: Again, Sue... you make great points. We have had many meetings with eBay executives all throughout eBay - face to face, conference calls, email communications, etc. I want to stress that this has been a very, very long-term effort and we have put a lot of our own time and money into this. This has not all happened on a lark. We have worked extensively with eBay, we have always been polite and professional with them, they are very aware of our credentials, who we are, etc. This will not ever be allowed to be a "Wild West" type of thing where everyone is shooting at each other just to eliminate their competition. This thing is being built slowly, brick-by-brick, with much though and attention to detail. In fact, it's still very much a work in progress. We're very excited, though, that it's finally moving forward and that we're starting to see some results. "Sue H" wrote in message .. . I do agree that Ebay shouldn't necessarily by one person's or one businesses "word" ... especially when they have no degree in authentication. We need to be a community and to do that, I also agree names should not be withheld. People need to work together. On the surface, it DOES appear that one can go to Ebay, say this and that is fake it COULD seem that they are dealers trying to boost their own name. Also, Ebay DOES need to check into them. For example, if I email them, I would most certainly like them to research me. See who I am, what I do, talk to me to find out my motivations. I would welcome that. Goodness often wins out, but usually after eons of being opressed. On 4 Nov 2005 16:06:00 -0800, "barefoot" wrote: again, i'm not discounting his measures...in fact, he's preaching to the choir on this one...all i'm saying is that he should let HIS stuff be stood up and accounted for... there are plenty of people out there seing fake stuff that don't know it, and fight hard like he's claiming to do...only to be unknowingly selling bad stuff...his reluctance to state his seller name shows his fear that HE may be brought out too... and yes, i was suspended for unscrupuous behavior. but have been deemed worthy by the ewbay community once again. and i sign my name to everything, and i let anyone know exactly what i am selling... and i wish that by people pulling bad stuff off ebay would actually help (especially during the holidays since little kids buy autographs for dad and dad buys that michael vick auto his kid wants and neither knows they are buying fake stuff) that's besides the point...LET US KNOW WHO YOU ARE, JUDGE NOT LEST YE BE JUDGED! mike |
#27
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Well, if true, it's an honorable thing and I'd love to know at some
point who you are, what you sell, and if Ebay does anything about it. I would LOVE to give them thoughts myself. They are more seller oriented than buyer oriented, so I'd love to see a little more regulation and balance. Also, I am all for elimating and even putting forgers away. Or suing them for damages so that they can never afford to get back into the business... On Sat, 05 Nov 2005 00:43:52 GMT, "Auto Cop" wrote: Again, Sue... you make great points. We have had many meetings with eBay executives all throughout eBay - face to face, conference calls, email communications, etc. I want to stress that this has been a very, very long-term effort and we have put a lot of our own time and money into this. This has not all happened on a lark. We have worked extensively with eBay, we have always been polite and professional with them, they are very aware of our credentials, who we are, etc. This will not ever be allowed to be a "Wild West" type of thing where everyone is shooting at each other just to eliminate their competition. This thing is being built slowly, brick-by-brick, with much though and attention to detail. In fact, it's still very much a work in progress. We're very excited, though, that it's finally moving forward and that we're starting to see some results. "Sue H" wrote in message .. . I do agree that Ebay shouldn't necessarily by one person's or one businesses "word" ... especially when they have no degree in authentication. We need to be a community and to do that, I also agree names should not be withheld. People need to work together. On the surface, it DOES appear that one can go to Ebay, say this and that is fake it COULD seem that they are dealers trying to boost their own name. Also, Ebay DOES need to check into them. For example, if I email them, I would most certainly like them to research me. See who I am, what I do, talk to me to find out my motivations. I would welcome that. Goodness often wins out, but usually after eons of being opressed. On 4 Nov 2005 16:06:00 -0800, "barefoot" wrote: again, i'm not discounting his measures...in fact, he's preaching to the choir on this one...all i'm saying is that he should let HIS stuff be stood up and accounted for... there are plenty of people out there seing fake stuff that don't know it, and fight hard like he's claiming to do...only to be unknowingly selling bad stuff...his reluctance to state his seller name shows his fear that HE may be brought out too... and yes, i was suspended for unscrupuous behavior. but have been deemed worthy by the ewbay community once again. and i sign my name to everything, and i let anyone know exactly what i am selling... and i wish that by people pulling bad stuff off ebay would actually help (especially during the holidays since little kids buy autographs for dad and dad buys that michael vick auto his kid wants and neither knows they are buying fake stuff) that's besides the point...LET US KNOW WHO YOU ARE, JUDGE NOT LEST YE BE JUDGED! mike |
#28
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Exciting News
But to push them to end auction when they have no resident autograph
expert (I've not heard of that one yet though I know they do employ some people to help with knockoffs and also some people who look for things like obscenities and contraband etc), you must've prestented yourself knowledable about the subject... So for them to end auctions, they must be using "someone" to determine it's forgeries....that's who we want to know about. On Sat, 05 Nov 2005 00:49:07 GMT, "Auto Cop" wrote: Let me try again to make this clear. Yes, this is a small group of highly reputable people. But no, we are not necessarily the ones who will be making the call. Our role has simply been to push eBay to start to deal with this problem. That is why who "we" are is not particularly relevent, unless you're one of the "bad guys". And, no one was "asked". This is something we've all just done. I hope this is getting though. Again, our role has simply been to press eBay on this issue. We're not actually ending auctions, etc. Seriously, some of you are just totally missing the point. "Sue H" wrote in message .. . Who are all these people involved? No one here was asked? And what makes them experts? On Sat, 05 Nov 2005 00:15:27 GMT, "Auto Cop" wrote: Mike, O.K., first you annoyed me, then you angered me, now you're just making me laugh. You can say whatever you want about me, I simply don't care. Again, my stuff on eBay is just as available for scrutiny as every other sellers. If I were a forger and if I were not a recognized expert in my field and if I had any question about what I was selling I'd be an idiot to push for what I've been pushing for the last 5+ years. If you're too thick to understand that, I can't help you. The people involved in this effort are some of the most respected people in the field (dealers and collectors). For someone like you to cast aspersions on this group is quite humorous. Again, if you can't support the effort because you can't get your curiousity satisfied, then that's your prerogative. "barefoot" wrote in message egroups.com... again, i'm not discounting his measures...in fact, he's preaching to the choir on this one...all i'm saying is that he should let HIS stuff be stood up and accounted for... there are plenty of people out there seing fake stuff that don't know it, and fight hard like he's claiming to do...only to be unknowingly selling bad stuff...his reluctance to state his seller name shows his fear that HE may be brought out too... and yes, i was suspended for unscrupuous behavior. but have been deemed worthy by the ewbay community once again. and i sign my name to everything, and i let anyone know exactly what i am selling... and i wish that by people pulling bad stuff off ebay would actually help (especially during the holidays since little kids buy autographs for dad and dad buys that michael vick auto his kid wants and neither knows they are buying fake stuff) that's besides the point...LET US KNOW WHO YOU ARE, JUDGE NOT LEST YE BE JUDGED! mike |
#29
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Exciting News
Thanks for your input, Cliff, but it's already gone far beyond lipservice.
"Cliff" wrote in message ... Bottom line is you are dreaming. Ebay teamed with the ANA, the largest organization representing coin collectors in this country, and nothing has changed. There is too much money for ebay to make. They are now and always will be "a venue". If you've gotten anything, you've gotten lipservice. Cliff On Sat, 05 Nov 2005 00:43:52 GMT, "Auto Cop" wrote: Again, Sue... you make great points. We have had many meetings with eBay executives all throughout eBay - face to face, conference calls, email communications, etc. I want to stress that this has been a very, very long-term effort and we have put a lot of our own time and money into this. This has not all happened on a lark. We have worked extensively with eBay, we have always been polite and professional with them, they are very aware of our credentials, who we are, etc. This will not ever be allowed to be a "Wild West" type of thing where everyone is shooting at each other just to eliminate their competition. This thing is being built slowly, brick-by-brick, with much though and attention to detail. In fact, it's still very much a work in progress. We're very excited, though, that it's finally moving forward and that we're starting to see some results. "Sue H" wrote in message . .. I do agree that Ebay shouldn't necessarily by one person's or one businesses "word" ... especially when they have no degree in authentication. We need to be a community and to do that, I also agree names should not be withheld. People need to work together. On the surface, it DOES appear that one can go to Ebay, say this and that is fake it COULD seem that they are dealers trying to boost their own name. Also, Ebay DOES need to check into them. For example, if I email them, I would most certainly like them to research me. See who I am, what I do, talk to me to find out my motivations. I would welcome that. Goodness often wins out, but usually after eons of being opressed. On 4 Nov 2005 16:06:00 -0800, "barefoot" wrote: again, i'm not discounting his measures...in fact, he's preaching to the choir on this one...all i'm saying is that he should let HIS stuff be stood up and accounted for... there are plenty of people out there seing fake stuff that don't know it, and fight hard like he's claiming to do...only to be unknowingly selling bad stuff...his reluctance to state his seller name shows his fear that HE may be brought out too... and yes, i was suspended for unscrupuous behavior. but have been deemed worthy by the ewbay community once again. and i sign my name to everything, and i let anyone know exactly what i am selling... and i wish that by people pulling bad stuff off ebay would actually help (especially during the holidays since little kids buy autographs for dad and dad buys that michael vick auto his kid wants and neither knows they are buying fake stuff) that's besides the point...LET US KNOW WHO YOU ARE, JUDGE NOT LEST YE BE JUDGED! mike |
#30
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Exciting News
Cliff, I am disappointed in you. Is it better to even rid the
community of even ONE mass dealer who deals in fakes? I am cynical of the motivations and questionable education of the outters as one should always be concerned; BUT.... to NOT do nothing is what most people do here. So with that said, I applaud them (providing all motivations are pure and the poeple they are after are indeed frauds). Better to try and fail than sit passively and watch your fellow collectors get ripped off! On Fri, 04 Nov 2005 19:53:19 -0500, Cliff wrote: I don't want to bust anyone's bubble too badly but, I'm going to. First, autographs are not the only area that has a lot of fakes and scams. Coins was one area where it was rampant. After years of pleading and sending evidence Ebay agreed to partner with the American Numismatic Association (ANA) and they were going to clean up the fakes, etc. After several years of being in bed with ANA exactly no auctions, except for the most blatant have been pulled. Every day 100s of fake coins are put up by Chinese sellers and these even have coins that were never minted in the US and some of these are going for big bucks to the uninformed. Basically if we bellyache enough about an auction they will take a look but say "we are just a venue and we aren't experts on this item". You can look forward to more of the same. No matter what someone has told you, it's not going to change. If ebay has a big power seller making them a whole lot of money selling fake autographs, unless they are pinned down by the FBI or Secret Service, they are not going to cut into their income source. Again, ebay is not an expert on anything. Stop your celebrating and get to living in the real world. Cliff On Fri, 04 Nov 2005 19:33:47 -0500, Sue H wrote: I do agree that Ebay shouldn't necessarily by one person's or one businesses "word" ... especially when they have no degree in authentication. We need to be a community and to do that, I also agree names should not be withheld. People need to work together. On the surface, it DOES appear that one can go to Ebay, say this and that is fake it COULD seem that they are dealers trying to boost their own name. Also, Ebay DOES need to check into them. For example, if I email them, I would most certainly like them to research me. See who I am, what I do, talk to me to find out my motivations. I would welcome that. Goodness often wins out, but usually after eons of being opressed. On 4 Nov 2005 16:06:00 -0800, "barefoot" wrote: again, i'm not discounting his measures...in fact, he's preaching to the choir on this one...all i'm saying is that he should let HIS stuff be stood up and accounted for... there are plenty of people out there seing fake stuff that don't know it, and fight hard like he's claiming to do...only to be unknowingly selling bad stuff...his reluctance to state his seller name shows his fear that HE may be brought out too... and yes, i was suspended for unscrupuous behavior. but have been deemed worthy by the ewbay community once again. and i sign my name to everything, and i let anyone know exactly what i am selling... and i wish that by people pulling bad stuff off ebay would actually help (especially during the holidays since little kids buy autographs for dad and dad buys that michael vick auto his kid wants and neither knows they are buying fake stuff) that's besides the point...LET US KNOW WHO YOU ARE, JUDGE NOT LEST YE BE JUDGED! mike |
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