First Flight commem coin sales ended

There was a recent announcement that sales of the First Flight commem coins
have ended at 33% of maximum allowed (1.35 million). Was the entire
authorized mintage of proof/unc gold eagles, dollars and halves produced, or
were the coins essentially "minted to order"? If more were minted than
actually sold, will the surplus then be melted? Sold in bulk to dealers?
Stored away in vaults? Should we consider buying some 2003-P BU F/F dollars
on the secondary market, considering actual mint sales of only 53,761
pieces, or is this a typical mintage for these commems?

Bruce

Bruce Remick wrote:

There was a recent announcement that sales of the First Flight commem coins
have ended at 33% of maximum allowed (1.35 million). Was the entire
authorized mintage of proof/unc gold eagles, dollars and halves produced, or
were the coins essentially "minted to order"? If more were minted than
actually sold, will the surplus then be melted? Sold in bulk to dealers?
Stored away in vaults? Should we consider buying some 2003-P BU F/F dollars
on the secondary market, considering actual mint sales of only 53,761
pieces, or is this a typical mintage for these commems?

Bruce

I'm eagerly anticipating knowledgeable answers to your probitive
questions, Bruce. ;-) I've always guessed that Modern Commems do halt
production and restart production based on demand, but I do not know.
In the earlier Commem program, remelting of unwanted Commems was a
hassle and a common event, and I would expect modern production
practices to have worked to avoid a 'remelt' situation.

FWIW, I own a 1997 'Botanic Gardens' Unc. Dollar of similiar mintage
(57,272) and pricewise, it's not moving anywhere. ;-/

Alan
'everyone wants Proof'

Alan Williams wrote:
FWIW, I own a 1997 'Botanic Gardens' Unc. Dollar of similiar mintage
(57,272) and pricewise, it's not moving anywhere. ;-/

It seems like there's about 20,000 collectors of uncirculated modern
commems. Those with mintages above that wallow in low prices; below that
get into the hundreds (with some exceptions, like your famous Buffalo
Buck). The super low mintage gold goes to thousands.

Can you imagine the price a Lincoln cent would fetch if its mintage was
only 57,272?

--
Bob

Bob Flaminio wrote:

Alan Williams wrote:
FWIW, I own a 1997 'Botanic Gardens' Unc. Dollar of similiar mintage
(57,272) and pricewise, it's not moving anywhere. ;-/

It seems like there's about 20,000 collectors of uncirculated modern
commems. Those with mintages above that wallow in low prices; below that
get into the hundreds (with some exceptions, like your famous Buffalo
Buck). The super low mintage gold goes to thousands.

Can you imagine the price a Lincoln cent would fetch if its mintage was
only 57,272?

--
Bob

At a guess, roughly that of a 1955/55. ;-) Between $600 and $15,000
depending on state of preservation. It depends in large degree on
distribution method, IMO. The Cleveland Commem has a similar mintage
(50,030) and it's a $60/$80 piece in low MS. I bought an NGC MS-64 for
about $60 a couple years ago. Items sold directly to collectors have
smaller secondary markets than pieces that must be recovered from
general Mint production.

The Famous Buffalo Buck had a 'distribution problem' even with 500,000
made. ;-) I'm just not a believer in it's future continued acceleration.
I hope no one I know got into buying mass quantities at the $150+
level. I think prices must remain semi-stiff because of the initial
run-up and the subsequent extravagant cost for dealers to stock them. I
still think that under $80 is where a raw Proof example *should* price,
but I confess I stopped even monitoring it about a year ago. ;-)

Alan
'would trade a roll of circulated 1962-D Jeffs for one'

"Bob Flaminio" wrote in message
...
Alan Williams wrote:
FWIW, I own a 1997 'Botanic Gardens' Unc. Dollar of similiar mintage
(57,272) and pricewise, it's not moving anywhere. ;-/

It seems like there's about 20,000 collectors of uncirculated modern
commems. Those with mintages above that wallow in low prices; below that
get into the hundreds (with some exceptions, like your famous Buffalo
Buck). The super low mintage gold goes to thousands.

Can you imagine the price a Lincoln cent would fetch if its mintage was
only 57,272?

--
Bob


Hardly. Especially if it were a "regular" mint issue, rather than an "I'm
not gonna count that one" variety like the 1955 DDO. I was just pondering
if in the future collectors will be kicking themselves for not having jumped
on some of the low mintage, overlooked(?) BU commems, instead of putting all
their money into proofs. But then maybe by then the whole commem business
will have overblown itself like it did in the 1940's.

I'm still curious as to how the mint handles production of these coins and
if any end up destroyed or stored away somewhere.

Bruce

"Alan Williams" wrote in message
...

I'm eagerly anticipating knowledgeable answers to your probitive
questions, Bruce. ;-) I've always guessed that Modern Commems do halt
production and restart production based on demand, but I do not know.

I'll give you my wild-assed guess of an answer.. you know how you go to The
Mint's site as soon as something new comes out and you order it and get it
right away, and then you go back and look a week or so later and it says
"Product will be available on MM/DD/YY" which is usually a couple weeks to a
month away??.. Well what that tells me is that they make them in batches..
and when they see how fast the first batch is selling, then they decide to
make a second batch, and so on, until no one orders any more.. but usually
there's a flurry of sales right before the authorized sales period ends,
from the people who put it off, for whatever reason..

I would guess they make some number of thousands at a time, and then make
some number of thousands more when that first batch sells out or gets close
to selling out.. maybe I'm playing with semantics there, but "on demand"
makes it sound more like "Oh look, someone ordered one, tell Fred to fire up
the press and make one."

Since The Buffalo Dollar three years ago, has there been any single
Commemorative, Half, Dollar, or Gold, Unc., or Proof which has totally sold
out its authorized Mintage??..


Harv

I seem to recall picking up a bit of info about the "limit" on modern
comms.

As I recall, I read that the mint DOES stop when the demand does. IOW,
if the authorized number is 500,000 but the demand is only 20,000, the
mint stops somewhere near that lower number.

I'm sorry to say that I cannot recall where I read that.


I count modern comms among a wide variety of my collecting interests
(my pride and joy is my collection of uncirc Morgans), and I buy
everything the US Mint puts out, usually on the day I receive their
"announcement" e-mail.

--for example, I just bought the L&C w/ Native American "pouch" set for
$120.00.

Pretty steep, I thought, but if it drops in value (like many others
have), I can live with it.

The L&C 'coin & currency' set (which I was not impressed with), sold out
in 6 days according to the Mint's e-mailed sales pitch for the 'pouch'
set.

I did buy the coin/currency set for $90 from the Mint, and first became
aware of it's sold-out status when I saw it advertised in
Coast-to-Coast's catalog for $159.

Aside from the "gift-type" sets mentioned above, I buy all dollar and
half sets; I buy 'em singly, with $5.00 gold pieces, and every other way
they've sold them.

.....and always both proof and uncirc.

In addition to the Buffalo $'s well-known high rise, I do have a few
modern comms that also rose in value-- some to many times what I paid
for them.

Among them-

the VietnamVet/Women's/&/POW 3-coin set
(as well as the single component coins)

the tiny gold/platinum bi-metallic piece

the "law enforcement" comm

the 1996-S Nat'l Community Service uncirc

a variety of mid-90's Olympic uncirc's for various sports, from various
mints (I've seen some advertised from $250 to $300 by retailers) all
with mintage numbers ranging from about 12,000 to 15,000.

Also, some of the Black patriot pieces, uncirc & proof, have surprised
me with their current retail prices.

There are others I can't bring to mind at the moment.

BTW, all of my comms and comm sets are in original boxes, with COA's,
natch.-


---I also have the Botanical pieces (proof & uncirc), and yes-- their
value has gone nowhere

that happens, too....

....but overall, I can't say I'm in the 'minus-column' with modern comms

I seem to recall picking up a bit of info about the "limit" on modern
comms.

As I recall, I read that the mint DOES stop when the demand does. IOW,
if the authorized number is 500,000 but the demand is only 20,000, the
mint stops somewhere near that lower number.

I'm sorry to say that I cannot recall where I read that.


I count modern comms among a wide variety of my collecting interests
(my pride and joy is my collection of uncirc Morgans), and I buy
everything the US Mint puts out, usually on the day I receive their
"announcement" e-mail.

--for example, I just bought the L&C w/ Native American "pouch" set for
$120.00.

Pretty steep, I thought, but if it drops in value (like many others
have), I can live with it.

The L&C 'coin & currency' set (which I was not impressed with), sold out
in 6 days according to the Mint's e-mailed sales pitch for the 'pouch'
set.

I did buy the coin/currency set for $90 from the Mint, and first became
aware of it's sold-out status when I saw it advertised in
Coast-to-Coast's catalog for $159.

Aside from the "gift-type" sets mentioned above, I buy all dollar and
half sets; I buy 'em singly, with $5.00 gold pieces, and every other way
they've sold them.

....and always both proof and uncirc.

In addition to the Buffalo $'s well-known high rise, I do have a few
modern comms that also rose in value-- some to many times what I paid
for them.

Among them-

the VietnamVet/Women's/&/POW 3-coin set
(as well as the single component coins)

the tiny gold/platinum bi-metallic piece

the "law enforcement" comm

the 1996-S Nat'l Community Service uncirc

a variety of mid-90's Olympic uncirc's for various sports, from various
mints (I've seen some advertised from $250 to $300 by retailers) all
with mintage numbers ranging from about 12,000 to 15,000.

Also, some of the Black patriot pieces, uncirc & proof, have surprised
me with their current retail prices.

There are others I can't bring to mind at the moment.

BTW, all of my comms and comm sets are in original boxes, with COA's,
natch.-


---I also have the Botanical pieces (proof & uncirc), and yes-- their
value has gone nowhere

that happens, too....

...but overall, I can't say I'm in the 'minus-column' with modern comms


The 1997 issue of Jackie Robinson comes to mind. The uncirculated
gold 5.00 piece (mintage of 5174) is very pricey, 2,000.00 and up.
The proof is selling in the neighborhood of 400.00 - 500.00 and a gold
and silver set just sold on ebay for 2,499.00.

__________________________________________________ _____________________
SteveM

The 1997 issue of Jackie Robinson comes to mind. The uncirculated
gold 5.00 piece (mintage of 5174) is very pricey, 2,000.00 and up.

Yup, it's the key date of the series, and it has soared. #3, the 2000 Library
of Congress bimetallic $10 UNC (mintage 6683), is also over $1000.

But you can still buy #2, the 2001 Capitol Visitor's Center $5 UNC (mintage of
6183) for a few hundred dollars.

Regards,
Tom