How to report shill bidders to the FBI

On 8/5/2010 6:23 AM, Relayer wrote:
On Aug 3, 6:36 am, wrote:
When you suspect this I suggest you report it as a crime for investigation
with shill bidders. Seller can get up to 10 years -www.cybercrime.govto
learn more.

Engaging Law Enforcement on suspicious activity is your job also. Don't
neglect that aspect. If we want ebay to stay clean, it has to happen. I had
a suspicious reverse shill expose my reserve, so I am making a report
(Administrative Cancel). The FBI is cracking down (at least as I understand
it).

Cyber crime of shills is very catchable in the long run. Since you provided
email addresses and IP;s in using the site, reverse lookups of public
infomation can track down networks of shills. Shilling requires a naive
seller or bidder. Report the suspected crime not just to ebay. Keep ebay
informed if you plan to report suspicious activity. Shilling on ebay may be
somewaht common, but it's a stupid crime. You'd have to do enough to make it
worth while, and then your activity is noticed by the fraud investigation
systems for targeting.

If you are a criminal - stop, If you are thinking about doing it - don't.
There are ways to catch you that even a ordinary computer person like me
knows. Besides remember even the police buy and sell on ebay. 1 in 99
sellers is likely in Law Enforcement, legal (attorney), a security or in
some type of justice role. I am not, but do I really want to take a
chance???

I have used Intellius for one background check in another area (not ebay),
it costs but was worth it.

How do they know who you are shilling with... Google links and social
networking, is just the start.

Vigilant reporting is key, and not just to ebay....

They best way to prevent being a "victim" of it is to bid your best
price and leave it at that.

Always bid your proxy max ONCE and VERY LATE in the auction.

If the price at that point does not meet your goals, do not bid.
If the price does meet your goals, it does not matter in the least how
the price got to that point.

http://wwww.tinaja.com/glib/ebaybuys.pdf

--
Many thanks,

Don Lancaster voice phone: (928)428-4073
Synergetics 3860 West First Street Box 809 Thatcher, AZ 85552
rss: http://www.tinaja.com/whtnu.xml email:

Please visit my GURU's LAIR web site at http://www.tinaja.com

On 8/5/2010 8:45 AM, wrote:
On Aug 3, 7:36 am, wrote:
When you suspect this I suggest you report it as a crime for investigation
with shill bidders. Seller can get up to 10 years -www.cybercrime.govto
learn more.

Engaging Law Enforcement on suspicious activity is your job also. Don't
neglect that aspect. If we want ebay to stay clean, it has to happen. I had
a suspicious reverse shill expose my reserve, so I am making a report
(Administrative Cancel). The FBI is cracking down (at least as I understand
it).

Cyber crime of shills is very catchable in the long run. Since you provided
email addresses and IP;s in using the site, reverse lookups of public
infomation can track down networks of shills. Shilling requires a naive
seller or bidder. Report the suspected crime not just to ebay. Keep ebay
informed if you plan to report suspicious activity. Shilling on ebay may be
somewaht common, but it's a stupid crime. You'd have to do enough to make it
worth while, and then your activity is noticed by the fraud investigation
systems for targeting.

If you are a criminal - stop, If you are thinking about doing it - don't.
There are ways to catch you that even a ordinary computer person like me
knows. Besides remember even the police buy and sell on ebay. 1 in 99
sellers is likely in Law Enforcement, legal (attorney), a security or in
some type of justice role. I am not, but do I really want to take a
chance???

I have used Intellius for one background check in another area (not ebay),
it costs but was worth it.

How do they know who you are shilling with... Google links and social
networking, is just the start.

Vigilant reporting is key, and not just to ebay....

rat *******


The 43 Vigilant was a classic.
Only 154 were produced because of wartime economics.


--
Many thanks,

Don Lancaster voice phone: (928)428-4073
Synergetics 3860 West First Street Box 809 Thatcher, AZ 85552
rss: http://www.tinaja.com/whtnu.xml email:

Please visit my GURU's LAIR web site at http://www.tinaja.com

On Aug 5, 7:59*am, "Mr. Jaggers" wrote:
Relayer wrote:

[cross-posted material removed]

They best way to prevent being a "victim" of it is to bid your best
price and leave it at that.

That does not solve the problem, because of the way proxy bidding works.
Whether it's an advance bid or a snipe bid makes no difference, either. *A
shill bid placed at any time still increases the amount that the winning
bidder must pay. *He might enjoy the satisfaction of winning, but he still
pays more because of it.

Due to eBay's current protocol, the likelihood of being shilled at some time
or other is very high, while the likelihood of knowing that you have been
shilled in a specific case and being able to prove it is very small. *That
is the reason that eBay will not waste its resources following up on each
and every shilling allegation it receives.

Several years ago I reported a sickeningly obvious shill to eBay - the shill
bidder was an employee of the coin dealer who had posted the auction, and I
knew both of them. *The perpetrator got slapped for it, but that was back
when a bidder's ID was much more transparent. *It would be massively more
difficult to accomplish that today.

James the Occasional Victim

You've said it well, mon vieux. I well might want the item at my
maximum bid, but why do I want to pay that if I can get the item for
less???

Everything that ebay has done over the last one or two years to reduce
the transparency of their "auctions" plays into the hands of the ebay
seller with a heart of larceny.

oly

On Aug 5, 8:23*am, Relayer wrote:

They best way to prevent being a "victim" of it is to bid your best
price and leave it at that.

While that will limit you to paying what you were willing, you can
still end up paying more than you should.

The fake/shill bid will run your bid up and possibly outbid it.
You'll get a second-chance offer. Seller gets the maximum possible.

Don's answer is best (snipe with your max. bid). In fact, e-bay
should allow the option of a silent bid. This defeats the "it's just
another $" psychology of the auction that drives prices up, so won't
ever happen.

- Kerry

oly wrote:
On Aug 5, 7:59 am, "Mr. Jaggers" wrote:
Relayer wrote:

[cross-posted material removed]

They best way to prevent being a "victim" of it is to bid your best
price and leave it at that.

That does not solve the problem, because of the way proxy bidding
works. Whether it's an advance bid or a snipe bid makes no
difference, either. A shill bid placed at any time still increases
the amount that the winning bidder must pay. He might enjoy the
satisfaction of winning, but he still pays more because of it.

Due to eBay's current protocol, the likelihood of being shilled at
some time or other is very high, while the likelihood of knowing
that you have been shilled in a specific case and being able to
prove it is very small. That is the reason that eBay will not waste
its resources following up on each and every shilling allegation it
receives.

Several years ago I reported a sickeningly obvious shill to eBay -
the shill bidder was an employee of the coin dealer who had posted
the auction, and I knew both of them. The perpetrator got slapped
for it, but that was back when a bidder's ID was much more
transparent. It would be massively more difficult to accomplish that
today.

James the Occasional Victim

You've said it well, mon vieux. I well might want the item at my
maximum bid, but why do I want to pay that if I can get the item for
less???

Everything that ebay has done over the last one or two years to reduce
the transparency of their "auctions" plays into the hands of the ebay
seller with a heart of larceny.

I guess we never really know if we got the best price, even when
face-to-face with a dealer at a show. It's all a big poker game, and he who
indulges with the idea that collecting coins is a profit-making activity is,
oh heck, fill in the blank with your favorite predicate
adjective_________________.

James the Diagrammer

Kerry Imming wrote:
...In fact, e-bay
should allow the option of a silent bid...

Which would be totally demisincongruent to the purpose
of an auction, and the purpose of eBay, and the purpose
of the seller presence - to maximize profits.


Lumpy

In Your Ears for Fifty Years!
www.LumpyMusic.com

On 8/5/2010 10:11 AM, Kerry Imming wrote:
On Aug 5, 8:23 am, wrote:

They best way to prevent being a "victim" of it is to bid your best
price and leave it at that.

While that will limit you to paying what you were willing, you can
still end up paying more than you should.

The fake/shill bid will run your bid up and possibly outbid it.
You'll get a second-chance offer. Seller gets the maximum possible.

Don's answer is best (snipe with your max. bid). In fact, e-bay
should allow the option of a silent bid. This defeats the "it's just
another $" psychology of the auction that drives prices up, so won't
ever happen.

- Kerry


You ALWAYS pay more than you should.
Otherwise the transaction does not occur.


--
Many thanks,

Don Lancaster voice phone: (928)428-4073
Synergetics 3860 West First Street Box 809 Thatcher, AZ 85552
rss: http://www.tinaja.com/whtnu.xml email:

Please visit my GURU's LAIR web site at http://www.tinaja.com

In article ,
lid says...
1-800-CALLFBI

On 2010-08-03, Rander wrote:
When you suspect this I suggest you report it as a crime for investigation
with shill bidders. Seller can get up to 10 years - www.cybercrime.gov to
learn more.



snip

Use the direct line, 1-202-324-3000. Tell Director Mueller I sent you.

--
James E. Morrow
Email to:

In article , says...
Always bid your proxy max ONCE and VERY LATE in the auction.

If the price at that point does not meet your goals, do not bid.
If the price does meet your goals, it does not matter in the least how
the price got to that point.


Everybody memorize Don's post. It is all you need to know about
shilling. If you are not dumb nobody can shill you.

--
James E. Morrow
Email to:

In message

Kerry Imming was claimed to have wrote:

In fact, e-bay should allow the option of a silent bid.

Try Gixen.com...