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#1
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light fast but washable ink ?
Hi,
I am looking for a fountain pen ink that would be "light fast", I mean that wouldn't fade, even exposed to bright sun for a prolonged amount of time. I don't want a waterproof ink, on the contrary, I'd like it to be somewhat washable so that the paper can be recycled with less effort. In other words, I would like an ink that is not frogery-proof, but that will last years if not tampered with. I think a neutral ph would be a +, in order to not damage the media (paper, canvas etc...) over the years. With those criteria in mind, and hopefully some choice of colours (in red and blue !), what's out there ? Thanks, Yves. ---- http://www.cuug.ab.ca/dorfsmay http://www.SollerS.ca |
#2
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On 2004-09-28 20:51:10 -0700, no spam said:
I am looking for a fountain pen ink that would be "light fast", I mean that wouldn't fade, even exposed to bright sun for a prolonged amount of time. I don't want a waterproof ink, on the contrary, I'd like it to be somewhat washable so that the paper can be recycled with less effort. In other words, I would like an ink that is not frogery-proof, but that will last years if not tampered with. I think a neutral ph would be a +, in order to not damage the media (paper, canvas etc...) over the years. Non-fade but washable may not be easy - I'm not sure. Anyway, you need to visit http://www.inksampler.com Loads of information there on this kind of topic. David |
#3
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David wrote:
Non-fade but washable may not be easy - I'm not sure. Ok, I don't care that much about being washable, but I want an ink that can be removed somehow. This is for my every day writting, and I am worried that something like noodler's permanent would prevent proper recycling of the paper. Don't get me wrong, I thing that noodler's permanent has its place, for art, and for official document that must be forge-proof, etc... Yves. ---- Yves Dorfsman http://www.cuug.ab.ca/dorfsmay http://www.SollerS.ca |
#4
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"no spam" wrote in message news:eAL6d.544855$M95.356363@pd7tw1no... David wrote: Non-fade but washable may not be easy - I'm not sure. Ok, I don't care that much about being washable, but I want an ink that can be removed somehow. This is for my every day writting, and I am worried that something like noodler's permanent would prevent proper recycling of the paper. Why? Am I missing something? The only recycling problems that I'm aware of involve glossy paper, like what is used for magazines, and the recycler doesn't pick those up anymore. You should use a cross-cut shredder, anyway, for your personal stuff. -- ~~Bluesea~~ Spam is great in musubi but not in email. Please take out the trash before sending a direct reply. |
#5
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Bluesea wrote:
Why? Am I missing something? The only recycling problems that I'm aware of involve glossy paper, like what is used for magazines, and the recycler doesn't pick those up anymore. Recycled paper comes in white, or light brown for the non-bleached one. I am assuming that they "wash" the paper they use before being able to get to that light colored paper (or white). If everybody starts using an ink that can never be washed out regardless of the chimical used, then my guess is that it will be difficult to re-use that paper for recyling. I might be completely wrong, but that seems logical to me. Yves. ---- http://www.cuug.ab.ca/dorfsmay http://www.SollerS.ca |
#6
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"no spam" wrote: | Bluesea wrote: | | Why? Am I missing something? The only recycling problems that I'm aware of | involve glossy paper, like what is used for magazines, and the recycler | doesn't pick those up anymore. | | Recycled paper comes in white, or light brown for the non-bleached one. I | am assuming that they "wash" the paper they use before being able to get | to that light colored paper (or white). If everybody starts using an ink | that can never be washed out regardless of the chimical used, then my | guess is that it will be difficult to re-use that paper for recyling. | | I might be completely wrong, but that seems logical to me. But, but, but.... MOST paper destined for recycling has laser print on it. Relatively permanent, fused ink. Much of the rest has relatively nonpermanent, runny inkjet ink. That could color batches and batches of paper. The recyclers seem untroubled by it all. Methinks you worry too much. john cline ii, just being honest |
#7
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"no spam" wrote in message news:xK47d.153641$%S.2864@pd7tw2no... Bluesea wrote: Why? Am I missing something? The only recycling problems that I'm aware of involve glossy paper, like what is used for magazines, and the recycler doesn't pick those up anymore. Recycled paper comes in white, or light brown for the non-bleached one. I am assuming that they "wash" the paper they use before being able to get to that light colored paper (or white). If everybody starts using an ink that can never be washed out regardless of the chimical used, then my guess is that it will be difficult to re-use that paper for recyling. I might be completely wrong, but that seems logical to me. Yes, it's logical except for the fact that the number of people who write with fountain pens, much less those who write with Noodler's waterproof inks, is hugely insignificant in the grand scheme of things. If you're still set on not using Noodler's, I think your best bet is to follow David's link to inksampler.com. Good luck! -- ~~Bluesea~~ Spam is great in musubi but not in email. Please take out the trash before sending a direct reply. |
#8
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On Fri, 01 Oct 2004 04:07:57 GMT, no spam said:
no If everybody starts using an ink that can never be washed out no regardless of the chimical used, then my guess is that it will no be difficult to re-use that paper for recyling. if everyone starts using such inks (which is doubtful), then the different colours will tend to turn the batch of recycling gook grey -- which is pretty much what recycled paper looks like anyway. i think you're worrying too much. -- A squid eating DOUGH in a POLYETHYLENE bag is fast and BULBOUS. |
#9
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Lattice and reverse lattice? They are two new types of inks...when mixed they have properties unlike any others - including unrivaled color fastness when balanced properly. If you treat both kinds of inks as you would other inks, and properly care for your pen - rinse them now and then, don't store the ink for years without rinsing the pen out first....EXACTLY AS THE MANUFACTURERS OF FOUNTAIN PENS ADVISE... It was a risk to get into ink - given that purists wanted an ink they could "drink" and that smelled like roses or perfume....but the practical people desired something to keep our hobby alive. In all seriousness, I believed the fountain pen as a writing instrument was quietly, slowly and inevitably - being fundamentally undermined! The most obvious sign happened to be your average college kid. When I was in college - it was relatively easy to "convert" professors and students alike to the wonders of fountain pens. Within the past five years? No chance. First: "Those things cost too much." Once upon a time a $10 tip-dip, $2 cartridge pen, or $25 admiral with a gold nib solved that concern... However, #2 was devastating: "Nathan, I know these are nice writers and all...won't fill up landfills, refill again and again, super smooth, and has a real nice solid gold nib to resist corrosion until I am 80 years old...BUT the damn ink feathers on EVERY piece of paper I use in my classes and it is just not ever going to be a daily user. Sorry." If you are a pen collector - like it or not...if EVERY college kid rejects fountain pens...the hobby WILL decline in time. It used to be "Get a nice pen in their hand for sophomore year and they are a collector during grad school.". So - lattice inks and anti-feather inks MUST be made available to the public if our hobby is to survive in my humble opinion. Feathering on recycled papers and cheaper grades such as newsprint (which is often used for exam documents/pages and most government forms) has to be countered....and forgers must be countered with lattice inks. The forger/identity fraud threat was absolutely killing fountain pens with certain people who were in the habit of signing contracts and writing terms with certain chain store inks that wash off documents with 6 to 12 seconds run under tap water....or a few minutes of bleach. Either they have confidence in the fountain pen, or they will seek out and use some other instrument! If you care to throw stones at Noodler's Ink, I hope you at least consider the alternatives we were facing before it came into being....as a long term hobby. Lastly, this does not even mention the inks that have NOT been introduced to the public. Glow in the dark "Nigh****chman's Ink" will not be introduced because it reacts badly with other manufacturer's inks - if mixed even slightly with residues from their inks, this particular ink fails in its primary property (it must glow 100 hours per 1/2 hour charge of sunlight - repeatedly, and be clearly visible to the naked eye both in the dark and in various artificial and natural light sources). It is also completely unlike any ink ever made before, and until it gets long term testing behind it - Noodler's Ink will not release it. There are members of the public who would cast dispersions upon such a prototype ink before it was even given a chance...so I'm not giving them a bottle to do so with until/unless it is immunized. It is too different - if you saw a bottle (one pictured next to prototype water based white ink) you would know what I mean. http://members.aol.com/scaupaug1/glow/whiteGlow.jpg The Luddites would also seek to besmirch any of the white, pastel, and pearlized inks (green pearl, true gray pearl, rose pearl are shown in the following picture - they were made because of their visual effects in visuated pens...a transparent pen has the appearance of having 1930s pearltex effects - as well as having true pastel effects on the written page) http://members.aol.com/scaupaug1/marbled/marbledInk.jpg - which similarly are in long term testing before they will ever be released to the public (different feeds, different mixes with other company's inks, as many variables as possible need to be accounted for - or somebody online somewhere will say: "My such and such does not like the white ink."...I want to avoid that!). Perhaps a lack of confidence after realizing how severe the public can be - but now certainly necessary - as such inks must stand up to some pretty nasty perpetual critics. As for washable inks and inks that "you can drink"...if you want dye contents that low, don't buy Noodler's. Noodler's is going to continue to pack as much value in dye content and permanence as is possible for a water based fountain pen ink (with NO salts and NO crystalline acids!)...& with no weak low dye content washable inks contemplated.... Noodler's will also continue to make it's black ink (and other lattice inks such as "eternal" and "contract") as fraud proof as is possible for a fountain pen ink - if you want a weak black that feathers on recycled paper and newsprint - buy something else! I'm sorry that it is not possible to please everyone......but the efforts to help the hobby, and the viability of the fountain pen itself...will continue. Also...no need to shake! If when the bottle is finished, the bottom looks like the bottom of a finished 1950s style ink bottle...it's normal. It's not normal if you add contaminants such as salts to the ink...don't do that! Also, cap the bottle soon after filling - it is NOT "tap water" that makes the ink...it is beyond distilled - the most purified one can make with today's technology. Otherwise the dye contents would be lower ratios due to "other" substances getting in the way that don't belong in ink anyway. So, if you left the bottle cap off for a week long vacation - it is OK to replace the lost fluid with tap water...but in testing tap water is just not as good as distilled. It would be 90% performance instead of 100% performance. |
#10
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On 2004-09-29 21:03:22 -0700, no spam said:
, I don't care that much about being washable, but I want an ink that can be removed somehow. This is for my every day writting, and I am worried that something like noodler's permanent would prevent proper recycling of the paper. Don't get me wrong, I thing that noodler's permanent has its place, for art, and for official document that must be forge-proof, etc... I wouldn't worry too much then - any brand of ink that doesn't advertise itself as permanent, will probably fit your recycling concerns. Just pick one that has good light-fastness, and you'll be set. David |
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