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Fakes and Terrorism (Again)



 
 
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  #1  
Old May 27th 05, 05:02 PM
Mike Marotta
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Default Fakes and Terrorism (Again)

Here is a recent article from CNN Money.
http://money.cnn.com/2005/05/26/news/terror_knockoffs/

In my Numismatic Theater presentation on "Fakes: Threat or Menace?" at
the ANA Convention in Pittsburgh 2004, I delivered other information
like this, also from Interpol and Congressional testimony.

According to an article in the March 2004 CELATOR, fake ancient coins
have been salted into so-called "bulk lots" or "uncleaned lots."

The basic problem is that all illegal activities are pushed into the
same channels. People who smuggle cigarettes in one direction, smuggle
guns in another. This has little to do with "cigarettes" or "guns" in
themselves. Anyone who buys or sells fake coins is sleeping with dogs
and ultimately will wake up with fleas.

Michael E. Marotta

Ads
  #2  
Old May 27th 05, 07:20 PM
winwin
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Default

Michael E. Marotta preaches:

The basic problem is that all illegal activities are pushed into the
same channels. People who smuggle cigarettes in one direction, smuggle

guns in another.

Sure, Mike. And everyone who eats a
peanut will die of congestive heart failure.

Regards,
Tom

  #3  
Old May 27th 05, 07:40 PM
Reid Goldsborough
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On 27 May 2005 09:02:22 -0700, "Mike Marotta"
wrote:

The basic problem is that all illegal activities are pushed into the
same channels. People who smuggle cigarettes in one direction, smuggle
guns in another. This has little to do with "cigarettes" or "guns" in
themselves. Anyone who buys or sells fake coins is sleeping with dogs
and ultimately will wake up with fleas.


You're again comparing apples and orange seeds. You're again failing
to distinguish buying counterfeit items sold as authentic, which the
article you linked to talked about (knockoff handbags, T-shirts and
other accessories sold on the street and at flea markets), and
counterfeit items sold as counterfeit.

This, again, as to do with the money trail. Where is the money going?
With the former, with counterfeits sold as authentic, the money is
going to those who are doing the cheating. These can be petty crooks
or terrorist cells.

On the other hand, when you buy a counterfeit coin from someone who
had gotten cheated with it by buying it as authentic, who's willing to
sell it for a small sum of money (or even donate it), that money isn't
going to the person or persons who perpetuated the scam. It's going to
the person who was cheated and who wants to play a part in the effort
to educate consumers about counterfeit fraud. Such as transaction
doesn't support terrorism or the scams of terrorists. It does the
exact opposite by helping to prevent the sale of counterfeits as
authentic in the future.

Again.

--

Email: (delete "remove this")

Consumer:
http://rg.ancients.info/guide
Connoisseur: http://rg.ancients.info/glom
Counterfeit: http://rg.ancients.info/bogos
  #4  
Old May 27th 05, 08:06 PM
Edward McGrath
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Reid wrote: You're again comparing apples and orange seeds. snip
Aren't you glad you missed Michael's speech at the Pittsburgh convention
: )

  #5  
Old May 27th 05, 09:05 PM
Phil DeMayo
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Default

On Fri, 27 May 2005 14:40:37 -0400, Reid Goldsborough
wrote:

On the other hand, when you buy a counterfeit coin from someone who
had gotten cheated with it by buying it as authentic, who's willing to
sell it for a small sum of money (or even donate it), that money isn't
going to the person or persons who perpetuated the scam. It's going to
the person who was cheated and who wants to play a part in the effort
to educate consumers about counterfeit fraud. Such as transaction
doesn't support terrorism or the scams of terrorists. It does the
exact opposite by helping to prevent the sale of counterfeits as
authentic in the future.


Hmm...and you had the nads to accuse me of using the "ends justify the
means" argument.

This is one of the reasons why I chuckled when you made that
accusation. Need I mention your wife's eBay account again?

  #6  
Old May 27th 05, 09:44 PM
Ian
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Default

Mike Marotta wrote:
Here is a recent article from CNN Money.
http://money.cnn.com/2005/05/26/news/terror_knockoffs/

In my Numismatic Theater presentation on "Fakes: Threat or Menace?" at
the ANA Convention in Pittsburgh 2004, I delivered other information
like this, also from Interpol and Congressional testimony.

According to an article in the March 2004 CELATOR, fake ancient coins
have been salted into so-called "bulk lots" or "uncleaned lots."

The basic problem is that all illegal activities are pushed into the
same channels. People who smuggle cigarettes in one direction, smuggle
guns in another. This has little to do with "cigarettes" or "guns" in
themselves. Anyone who buys or sells fake coins is sleeping with dogs
and ultimately will wake up with fleas.

Michael E. Marotta


Michael, you obviously wish our small community to embrace your brand of
numismatic evangelism as if it were the one true path.

As an empirical observation, the people who inhabit rcc tend to have
sufficient intellectual capacity to make informed and reasoned
judgements for themselves. This fire and brimstone approach of yours
serves more to paint a picture of you as being somewhat `off planet'
than it does to lambast your intended targets.

I hasten to add that I have a growing collection of fakes / replicas /
and counterfeits (some marked, some not). So far, it has not entailed me
having to sleep with dogs, and I can happily report that I remain in a
flea free zone.

Ian
  #7  
Old May 27th 05, 11:08 PM
Reid Goldsborough
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On Fri, 27 May 2005 20:44:43 GMT, Ian
wrote:

Michael, you obviously wish our small community to embrace your brand of
numismatic evangelism as if it were the one true path.


Evangelism is the word, all write. And sanctimonious, hypocritical,
puritanical ... what else have I missed? Phil, help me out here.

As I've said before, this all is a very curious phenomenon in
numismatics, this demand that others behave according to the strictest
interpretations of all laws and codes of conduct. It has to do, I
believe, with the deception that's always been a part of the world of
numismatics and the larger world of money. And when you combine it
with the behavior of the people who are making these demands, behavior
that's often far less than ethical, the phenomenon becomes even more
curious.

I hasten to add that I have a growing collection of fakes / replicas /
and counterfeits (some marked, some not). So far, it has not entailed me
having to sleep with dogs, and I can happily report that I remain in a
flea free zone.


Whoever came up with the proverb about sleeping with dogs never owned
one. g

--

Email: (delete "remove this")

Consumer:
http://rg.ancients.info/guide
Connoisseur: http://rg.ancients.info/glom
Counterfeit: http://rg.ancients.info/bogos
  #9  
Old May 28th 05, 04:53 PM
Reid Goldsborough
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Posts: n/a
Default

On Sat, 28 May 2005 14:21:41 GMT, "Nick Knight"
wrote:

I know *I* am. Well, "missed" is not quite the proper word ... "chose to
skip" would be more appropriate. Even with a twit/killfile, I see too much
of his egotistical nonsense here. What, I should go listen to him to prove
further he's wacked? Not necessary, and much better uses of convention time
are always available.


I think two people showed up to that presentation, and both, alas,
were infested with fleas.

--

Email: (delete "remove this")

Consumer:
http://rg.ancients.info/guide
Connoisseur: http://rg.ancients.info/glom
Counterfeit: http://rg.ancients.info/bogos
  #10  
Old May 29th 05, 02:30 AM
Jeff R
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Default


"Reid Goldsborough" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 28 May 2005 14:21:41 GMT, "Nick Knight"
wrote:

I know *I* am. Well, "missed" is not quite the proper word ... "chose to
skip" would be more appropriate. Even with a twit/killfile,

snip noise

I think two people showed up to that presentation, and both, alas,
were infested with fleas.

--

Email: reidgold


http://mendosus.com/****i.html
http://mendosus.com/glomthis.html
http://mendosus.com/clueless.html
http://mendosus.com/reidisms.html
http://mendosus.com/anagrams.html



 




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