Tape Player Problem

ommadawn wrote:

From a trusted tech:

I've never heard of a run capacitor in an 8-Track. 8-Track players use DC
motors with permanent magnets, and "run" capacitors are normally used on
an
AC synchronous motor. It's more likely that the motor's bearing is shot,
which would cause that same symptom. Other causes are also possible.


AC motors were used on early model 8 track component playback decks. they
were also used on some of the better integreted receivers as well.
manufacturers discontinued the use of AC motors on most decks around the
mid seventies.
the AC motor equipped decks DID use a capacitor.

--
i have an 8 track mind

My other computer is your XP box.

On 29 Apr 2005 14:41:25 -0700, "trippingtoo8track"
wrote:

this information is wrong- many 8-track decks use AC MOTORS- such as
Akai 80-81-82, Wollensack 8050, some Sony TC-228, most Zenith, all JVC
I've seen, and many more. snip

He's right.

read the archives on AC motors, the AC motor
decks are the best. snip

He's not right here. IF the DC motor in the later decks is both a.)
properly lubricated, b.) not worn out, and c.) servo controlled, the
DC motored decks offer adjustable speed control, unavailable in AC
motor decks. They also offer electrical fast forward, all but
impossible with AC motors, unless they use a second 6 or 4 pole
winding, with is non-existant.

to get an ac motor to turn in the proper direction, and regulate the
speed to 3.75 IPS, they use a capacitor in series with the motor. snip

AC synchronous motors, by nature, and non-speed adjustable.

your trusted tech is mistaken snip

....and so is Noodles on the speed issue, but I'll give him the first
point.

dB

So what do I do, look for a cap on the motor and replace it?

"8 tracker from hell" wrote in message
...
ommadawn wrote:

From a trusted tech:

I've never heard of a run capacitor in an 8-Track. 8-Track players use
DC
motors with permanent magnets, and "run" capacitors are normally used on
an
AC synchronous motor. It's more likely that the motor's bearing is
shot,
which would cause that same symptom. Other causes are also possible.


AC motors were used on early model 8 track component playback decks. they
were also used on some of the better integreted receivers as well.
manufacturers discontinued the use of AC motors on most decks around the
mid seventies.
the AC motor equipped decks DID use a capacitor.

--
i have an 8 track mind

My other computer is your XP box.

ps- AC motors run off the cycle rate of the AC power (60 cyles), so
that sets the speed correctly dead on every time- the main reason why
an AC motor runs at the correct speed without a speed adjustment. The
DC motors had POS points in them that go out of adjustment over time-
and are a real bitch to adjust through a tiny hole in the motor. Some
DC motored decks have external adjustable motor speed- like the Pioneer
HR-99, 100. I had a Wollensak 8055 w/adjustable DC motor, the
wow/flutter made the deck unlistenable. Quite a few others have
complained about just how BAD the Wollensaks wow/flutter. AVOID THEM
except for the 8050, which has a superior AC motor.

ommadawn wrote:

So what do I do, look for a cap on the motor and replace it?

it is not directly mounted on the motor. you will find the capacitor
physically soldered to a terminal strip either underneath the transport or
on the side of the transport. it would not be hard to miss. it usually is
rated at .22 to .47 @ 250vac. it usually is brown colored (i have seen
them yellow colored) & they have a lead off of the ends of the body.
--
i have an 8 track mind

My other computer is your XP box.

follow the wires from the motor back- it will lead you to the
capacitor- cut it out of the circuit, take it to radio shack, and buy a
replacement, they are cheap less than $1 if memory serves- and solder
it back in

presto- it fixes it

I had one deck that shortly after the cap switch, the motor went too- a
good source for AC motors is the all in one AM/FM/8-track decks that
are often at the thrift stores for $5-10 each. I scavenge AC motors
from those crappy beat up am/fm/8-track decks, if they have broken
knobs, etc. AC motored decks are actually parts gold- not uncommon to
fill a shopping cart with them at the larger SA's for $5 each. Take
the transport, motor, knobs off them, and trash the rest.

On 1 May 2005 06:01:10 -0700, "trippingtoo8track"
wrote:

follow the wires from the motor back- it will lead you to the
capacitor- cut it out of the circuit, take it to radio shack snip

Only an idiot buys components at Rat Shack.

Go to an electronics store (Rat Shack is NOT an "electronics store")
and get an equal value (usually around .22 to .47 µF @ rated voltage)
Sprague "Orange Drop" or similar. Rat Shack carries the worst of Far
East production, usually production dropouts no one else would touch.
Friends don't let friends shop at Rat Shack.

presto- it fixes it snip

If you buy that cap at Rat Shack, it won't be "fixed" for long.

I had one deck that shortly after the cap switch, the motor went too- a
good source for AC motors is the all in one AM/FM/8-track decks that
are often at the thrift stores for $5-10 each. snip

That's because you probably put the wrong value cap in it and burned
out the windings once the motor quit turning. As I've said before,
Charlie Nudo (aka 66fourdoor on eBay) is NOT a "technician" and should
be avoided, both for advice and service.

I scavenge snip

....for a living...we know.

dB

On 30 Apr 2005 16:23:00 -0700, "trippingtoo8track"
wrote:

ps- AC motors run off the cycle rate of the AC power (60 cyles), so
that sets the speed correctly dead on every time- the main reason why
an AC motor runs at the correct speed without a speed adjustment. snip

Wrong again. Although a sychronous AC induction motor will lock into
the power line frequency to run, the belt drive is the problem. VERY
rarely will an AC deck be turning at the right speed, due to the
vagaries of indirect drive. Pros learned this in the '50s with Ampex
300s, which is why the 350 and later had direct capstan drive.

The
DC motors had POS points in them that go out of adjustment over time-
and are a real bitch to adjust through a tiny hole in the motor. snip

More BS from Noodles.

DC motors don't have "points", they have brushes, the only other wear
item in them besides the bearings. DC motors with high hours will
show both brush and commutator wear, but I've yet to set ONE in which
the brushes or commutator were worn enough to fail the motor...not
ONE.

Some
DC motored decks have external adjustable motor speed- like the Pioneer
HR-99, 100. I had a Wollensak 8055 w/adjustable DC motor, the
wow/flutter made the deck unlistenable. snip

That's because you don't know what the **** you're doing, Noodles. I
have the same deck; the wow/flutter readings @ 3 KHz using an MRL
alignment tape measured out to about .08% UNWEIGHTED...better than any
cassette deck of that era, and even better than the factory spec for
an Ampex 350U transport running at 15 IPS in the 1950s. You lose
again, ragpicker.

Quite a few others have
complained about just how BAD the Wollensaks wow/flutter. AVOID THEM
except for the 8050, which has a superior AC motor. snip

More delusional advice from a raving lunatic. I have three Wollensak
decks, all of them properly (the key word) serviced, and not ONE of
them has wow/flutter reading more than .08% unweighted. Using CBS
weighing, the figure drops to below .05% on them all, and an VERY low
..03% on the 8075 for reasons I haven't figured out yet.

However, some CARTS cause wow/flutter problems all on their own. I
griped about Columbia TC8 exhibiting a lot of flutter, and testing and
fooling around found most definitely that the problem was tape
shrinkage due to age causing too tight a tape wrap. Even if the
capstan is turning exactly at the right speed with NO variation, if
the tape is binding against the center hub when it comes out and
"jerks" out of the pancake, you'll hear this in the output as dropouts
and flutter.

Charlie Nudo is a complete moron, as well as a well documented
fraudster and petty thief. Avoid any of his advice.

dB

ommadawn- keep in mind all motors whether AC or DC use a belt too- so
belt condition is very important to deck performance- Too tight of a
belt will slow down a DC motored deck very easily. To loose of a belt
will drag the tapes.

The AC motors, being larger with much more torque, will play tapes that
a DC motor cannot play effectively. Esp. the heavier 90 minute blanks
and double length tapes.

Any knowledgeable tech or 8-tracker will tell you, an AC motor deck is
better. Just to a search in the archives about "ac motor"

On 2 May 2005 05:09:21 -0700, "trippingtoo8track"
wrote:

Any knowledgeable tech or 8-tracker will tell you, an AC motor deck is
better. Just to a search in the archives about "ac motor" snip

...and Charlie Nudo, aka trippingtoo8track (among several others) is
HARDLY knowledgeable. He is, in fact, a paranoid delusional with
permanent brain damage caused by excessive THC ingestion over the
years. Save yourself the trouble of trying to figure out his
problems...plonk him today!