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#11
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Dangerous Forgeries
"Bob" wrote in message
oups.com... Dave, Are you arguing that these forgeries are all die struck from newly-engraved dies? Or that some are cast from genuine coins? Or some of each? I haven't examined them personally and can't pronounce on that. However, Dr. Farhad Assar, listowner of Iranica-L examined the coins and should be able to provide those details. One in particular is very crude and looks like a tourist copy, These are not crude fakes. I don't know how much experience you have in authenticating the Parthian series, but both Assar and I consider these to be very dangerous. Dave Welsh Classical Coins www.classicalcoins.com but others seem to be casts and some appear genuine from the posted scans. Of course I cannot see the edges and don't know what the weights are. Bob Leonard |
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#12
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Dangerous Forgeries
"RayCanada" wrote in message
oups.com... Dave Thank you for the article, it would be interesting to hear about your thoughts on The Bavarian school of forgerys Bavarian school? What is that? Never heard of such a "school." and the Toronto group. My thoughts on the Toronto group are not complimentary. There is a certain sort of individual who believes that anything he can get away with in terms of deceiving and defrauding the unwary is OK, so long as laws are not transgressed in such a manner that he will actually be prosecuted for it. The Toronto forgery operation is believed to be run by a Vietnamese criminal gang in the Toronto underworld. They mostly sell 2nd or 3rd generation pressure cast fakes from Bulgarian and Peter Rosa type "seed" forgeries. At first their productions were easily spotted but they have gradually become more deceptive. They have exploited just about every loophole in Canadian laws and eBay regulations to deceive unwary eBay neophytes. Usually their auctions have a starting price of about 10% of the value of a genuine coin. A booklet was eventually put together by CFDL members and posted in the Files page of that group's website. Unfortunately Yahoo generated addresses for files are very long: http://f5.grp.yahoofs.com/v1/sOQmRAM...2nd %20Ed.doc The title is "The Toronto Classical Coin Forgeries and Other Coin Forgeries." This is a compendium of factual data and opinion. I won't vouch for the accuracy of everything in it, but there is some good information there. I had a strong interest in Consintine coins wanted to collect them but got scared off when I started to do some reading and saw how now even very common low cost coins are being forged. If you don't feel confident in your ability to discern wheat from chaff, buy your coins on VCoins or from reputable dealers, and stay away from eBay. I have plenty of nice Constantinian dynasty coins at reasonable prices, and so do many other reputable dealers. It has long been an adage in the law enforcement community that the easiest mark for crooks is someone looking for a seller who does not know what his wares are worth. If you see a "coin" for sale on eBay at much less than its normal value, rest assured that it won't actually sell for a low price if it is genuine. eBay is monitored by many knowledgeable dealers and collectrors looking for bargains. Even Bedouins in the desert in the Middle East know what ancient coins are worth. I once read an illuminating comment on that from a dealer who was invited into a Bedouin tent to examine some coins, and found a stack of recent auction catalogues from prestigious European dealers. Dave Welsh Classical Coins www.classicalcoins.com |
#13
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Dangerous Forgeries
Dave,
I have collected Parthian coins longer than you have. I agree with you that some of these are very dangerous, if indeed they are all fakes, but one in my opinion is not. Parthian silver coins have inscriptions made by a connect-the-dots method (drilling depressions at the ends of letters, then engraving lines to connect them). One of the fakes has an inscription made by freehand engraving, entirely unlike this technique, in very loose letters. That is what I meant by a tourist copy. Robert Leonard |
#14
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Dangerous Forgeries
Robert,
There are genuine Parthian coins with such loosely engraved freehand inscriptions. Not knowing which one you are referring to, I can't address this specific specimen. Dave Welsh Classical Coins www.classicalcoins.com "Bob" wrote in message oups.com... Dave, I have collected Parthian coins longer than you have. I agree with you that some of these are very dangerous, if indeed they are all fakes, but one in my opinion is not. Parthian silver coins have inscriptions made by a connect-the-dots method (drilling depressions at the ends of letters, then engraving lines to connect them). One of the fakes has an inscription made by freehand engraving, entirely unlike this technique, in very loose letters. That is what I meant by a tourist copy. Robert Leonard |
#15
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Dangerous Forgeries
"Mike Marotta" wrote in message oups.com... ... But really, you cannot cheat an honest man. ... I appreciate the sentiment behind this platitude, (that is, I *understand* it), but really, its got to be one of the silliest "truisms" about. -- Jeff R. (not even going to bother explaing why) |
#16
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Dangerous Forgeries
On 27 Mar 2006 18:20:24 -0800, "Mike Marotta"
wrote: I also agree with your comment about law enforcement and people who were "cheated." We fill out the forms. We say the empathetic things. But really, you cannot cheat an honest man. What about the people cheated by Enron? Where they all dishonest? Reclining Buddha The Original Couch Potato! |
#17
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Dangerous Forgeries
Reclining Buddha wrote:
On 27 Mar 2006 18:20:24 -0800, "Mike Marotta" wrote: I also agree with your comment about law enforcement and people who were "cheated." We fill out the forms. We say the empathetic things. But really, you cannot cheat an honest man. What about the people cheated by Enron? Where they all dishonest? Reclining Buddha The Original Couch Potato! Did they collect counterfeit coins too? |
#18
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Dangerous Forgeries
On Tue, 28 Mar 2006 14:26:11 GMT, Ian
wrote: Reclining Buddha wrote: On 27 Mar 2006 18:20:24 -0800, "Mike Marotta" wrote: I also agree with your comment about law enforcement and people who were "cheated." We fill out the forms. We say the empathetic things. But really, you cannot cheat an honest man. What about the people cheated by Enron? Where they all dishonest? Reclining Buddha The Original Couch Potato! Did they collect counterfeit coins too? More like counterfeit stock certificates, but close to the same result. Reclining Buddha The Original Couch Potato! |
#19
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Dangerous Forgeries
Reclining Buddha wrote:
On Tue, 28 Mar 2006 14:26:11 GMT, Ian wrote: Reclining Buddha wrote: On 27 Mar 2006 18:20:24 -0800, "Mike Marotta" wrote: I also agree with your comment about law enforcement and people who were "cheated." We fill out the forms. We say the empathetic things. But really, you cannot cheat an honest man. What about the people cheated by Enron? Where they all dishonest? Reclining Buddha The Original Couch Potato! Did they collect counterfeit coins too? More like counterfeit stock certificates, but close to the same result. True, excepting that there's (probably) more of a market for counterfeit coins than there is for Enron stock. Ian |
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