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  #241  
Old March 2nd 10, 01:50 AM posted to rec.collecting.coins
Bruce Remick
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 3,391
Default Collecting experience


"mazorj" wrote in message
...

"Mr. Jaggers" lugburzman[at]yahoo[dot]com wrote in message
...
mazorj wrote:
"Mr. Jaggers" lugburzman[at]yahoo[dot]com wrote in message
...
mazorj wrote:
"Mr. Jaggers" lugburzman[at]yahoo[dot]com wrote in message
...
mazorj wrote:

...
Damn! I would rate that as the motoring equivalent to finding a
1955-S doubled die cent in change.

1955-*S*???????

James the Gobsmacked

My bad. Originally I wrote it as a 1909-S VDB, then typed over and
deleted some characters to make it a more credible find - but
forgot
to lose the S.

Nothing get past your eagle eyes, damn them. :-I

I would hypothesize that the chances of finding a 1909-S VDB in
pocket change are massively larger than finding a 55 Doubled Die,
because they had 24X the mintage, and there are still a lot more
surviving SVDBs, even if half the original mintage has somehow
perished.

James the Actuary

Mmm... That goes to minted population, not circulating population. I
daresay that except for the rare finds from raided/stolen caches, any
circulating 1909 cent was snapped up into long-term storage by the
time we got our high school diplomas. Although most 1955 DD cents
probably have been grabbed off by knowledgeable collectors or are
languishing in the maws of bulk copper penny hoarders, I would think
that an errant 1955 DD has a much longer life expectancy out there in
circulation than a 100-year-old specimen. An obviously old, brown
1909 is going to attract a lot of eyeballs and will quickly be pulled,
even by non-collectors. A middling circulated 1955 strike, single or
double, is not going to do that. I still see 1950s cents mixed into
rolls and change, which is why I changed my post from the VDB to the
DD. The last time I got a 1909 cent of any variety in circulation was
way back when Sister Consommé was drilling the Holy Trinity into my
noggin while visions of filled Whitman folders danced in my head.


While it may be true that a 55DD has a much longer life expectancy in
circulation than an SVDB, the fact remains that the only way one is going
to find either is for, as you say, raided/stolen caches to enter
circulation, and there have to be collectively at least ten SVDBs in
those caches for every 55DD. The trick, of course, is to be that *first*
pair of eyeballs in either case! I never had that good fortune, even
back in nineteen mumbly nine when I was doing Luther's Small Catechism,
while secretly lusting after the female members of the class. Oh, and I,
too, lusted after filled Whitman folders.

James the Doubly Deprived


Okay, now I see the point where we parted ways in our thinking.

I submit that a small but finite number of 1955 DDs have been continuously
"in circulation" since 1955. By "in circulation" I mean that they haven't
been permanently removed for keeping by a collector. Some will have been
continuously in motion for routine purchases, some may have languished in
vaults for awhile, some may have been closeted for 10 or 20 years in some
non-numismatist's penny jar before they were reintroduced into the wild at
face value; but my point is that they have evaded capture for permanent
possession by a collector. Their numbers are extremely small - perhaps
only a few dozen - but unless you want to assume that every penny now in
circulation has been inspected by a collector and every 1955 DD has been
culled by them, a few of them must still be out there in the wild. Except
for the aforementioned minuscule number of raided specimens, you can't say
that about a 1909-S VDB. Even the clerk who can't recognize a dollar coin
when one is presented to him will intuitively know that "there must be
something valuable about that really old brown penny" and likely will
snatch it up even as he ignores the MS-58 1955 DD in the same till.

Practically speaking, the difference in our conclusions is more conceptual
than statistical. If the odds of finding a 1909-S VDB in your pocket
change are 1.000000 in a gazillion, the odds of finding a 1955 DD may be
something like 1.000001 in a gazillion. But... IMO those few undiscovered
circulating 1955 DDs are still out there waiting to be discovered in situ
by a vigilant collector.

- mazorj the Hair-Splitter


....on my way to Situ............... Hmmm. I guess my stupid GPS needs
updating........


Ads
  #242  
Old March 2nd 10, 02:23 AM posted to rec.collecting.coins
Reid Goldsborough[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 357
Default Collecting experience

On 3/1/2010 5:04 PM, Mr. Jaggers wrote:

I don't think there are any RCCers left. Reid said it, I believe it, and
that settles it.


You should read Breen more carefully. It's not enough to merely spend
four figures on having the book bound in gold and platinum. There's also
the words! He clear states on page 167 that RCC consists primarily of a
half dozen people chatting among themselves and believing that as a
result of the sometimes furious (and sometimes sluggish) pace of the
responses they elicit from one another the entire numismatic community
is hanging on their every word when the reality is that he like many
scores of others in the coin world stopped reading long ago, even before
they were incarcerated. I believe this is just another Breen
fabrication, but I believe that as with most (all?) Breen fabrications
there's a hint of truth behind it.

--

Consumer: http://rg.ancients.info/guide
Connoisseur: http://rg.ancients.info/glom
Counterfeit: http://rg.ancients.info/bogos
  #243  
Old March 2nd 10, 04:19 AM posted to rec.collecting.coins
Mr. Jaggers
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 5,523
Default Collecting experience

Reid Goldsborough wrote:
On 3/1/2010 5:04 PM, Mr. Jaggers wrote:

I don't think there are any RCCers left. Reid said it, I believe
it, and that settles it.


You should read Breen more carefully. It's not enough to merely spend
four figures on having the book bound in gold and platinum. There's
also the words! He clear states on page 167 that RCC consists
primarily of a half dozen people chatting among themselves and
believing that as a result of the sometimes furious (and sometimes
sluggish) pace of the responses they elicit from one another the
entire numismatic community is hanging on their every word when the
reality is that he like many scores of others in the coin world
stopped reading long ago, even before they were incarcerated. I
believe this is just another Breen fabrication, but I believe that as
with most (all?) Breen fabrications there's a hint of truth behind it.


Reid, you're such a card!

James the Incredulous


  #244  
Old March 2nd 10, 06:02 AM posted to rec.collecting.coins
[email protected]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,172
Default Collecting experience

In article , "mazorj" wrote:

wrote in message
...
In article , "mazorj"
wrote:

wrote in message
...
In article , "mazorj"
wrote:

wrote in message
news
....
in 1986 toyota dropped the celica-supra label and made the supra
a
sporty
car.
i have an 86 1/2, which has a dual overhead cam, fuel injected 6
banger,
the
good toyota 5 speed and great looking body. mine has all the
options
except
turbo and everything works. even the rear defogger.
it has 200 hp without the turbo, 230 with. it's a real kick in
the ass
to
drive. it isn't a drag racer, it get power form 2000 rpm up.
the late 70's were great cars too. after mid 90's, it became a
vette
clone
with prices to match. now it's a really expensive exotic.
mine has 200,000 miles and runs great.
lucky me!

Huh. The 78-79 "Celica Supra" was a sporty car. In fact, your
description
matches mine. In the early 1980s the Celica went to more of
luxury sedan.
Maybe they had split the "Supra" off from the Celica line by 1986.
For me
it was a very good compromise from the Detroit beasts.

I guess I don't have to tell you to hang onto yours!

- mazorj the Insanely Jealous

add to the collectibility and easy to get parts, i love this
particular
vehicle. it saved my life and it makes me happy just to drive.
shall i post pics in an auto group to flame your insanity's
flames. then
tell
you what i paid?
-someone the shameless.

Post away, Jose!

$1500. to be fair, i had to buy an ac charger kit for $35.
it's passed all the smogs easily. that's the biggest thing to be
cared for.


Damn! I would rate that as the motoring equivalent to finding a
1955-S doubled die cent in change.




to be fair, it needs some cosmetics. i should compound the paint and re-clear
coat it. i have new paint to redo the plastic bumbers and pieces. those will
happen when spring finally hits this month.
it's may all time fave car.
  #245  
Old March 2nd 10, 06:03 AM posted to rec.collecting.coins
[email protected]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,172
Default Collecting experience

In article , "Mr. Jaggers" lugburzman[at]yahoo[dot]com wrote:
mazorj wrote:
wrote in message
...
In article , "mazorj"
wrote:

wrote in message
...
In article , "mazorj"
wrote:

wrote in message
news
....
in 1986 toyota dropped the celica-supra label and made the supra
a
sporty
car.
i have an 86 1/2, which has a dual overhead cam, fuel injected 6
banger,
the
good toyota 5 speed and great looking body. mine has all the
options
except
turbo and everything works. even the rear defogger.
it has 200 hp without the turbo, 230 with. it's a real kick in
the ass
to
drive. it isn't a drag racer, it get power form 2000 rpm up.
the late 70's were great cars too. after mid 90's, it became a
vette
clone
with prices to match. now it's a really expensive exotic.
mine has 200,000 miles and runs great.
lucky me!

Huh. The 78-79 "Celica Supra" was a sporty car. In fact, your
description
matches mine. In the early 1980s the Celica went to more of
luxury sedan.
Maybe they had split the "Supra" off from the Celica line by 1986.
For me
it was a very good compromise from the Detroit beasts.

I guess I don't have to tell you to hang onto yours!

- mazorj the Insanely Jealous

add to the collectibility and easy to get parts, i love this
particular
vehicle. it saved my life and it makes me happy just to drive.
shall i post pics in an auto group to flame your insanity's
flames. then
tell
you what i paid?
-someone the shameless.

Post away, Jose!

$1500. to be fair, i had to buy an ac charger kit for $35.
it's passed all the smogs easily. that's the biggest thing to be
cared for.


Damn! I would rate that as the motoring equivalent to finding a
1955-S doubled die cent in change.


1955-*S*???????

James the Gobsmacked


it's in my error book.
  #246  
Old March 2nd 10, 06:15 AM posted to rec.collecting.coins
[email protected]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,172
Default Collecting experience

In article , "mazorj" wrote:

"Bruce Remick" wrote in message
news

"Mr. Jaggers" lugburzman[at]yahoo[dot]com wrote in message
...
mazorj wrote:
"Mr. Jaggers" lugburzman[at]yahoo[dot]com wrote in message
...
mazorj wrote:
"Mr. Jaggers" lugburzman[at]yahoo[dot]com wrote in message
...
mazorj wrote:

...
Damn! I would rate that as the motoring equivalent to finding a
1955-S doubled die cent in change.

1955-*S*???????

James the Gobsmacked

My bad. Originally I wrote it as a 1909-S VDB, then typed over and
deleted some characters to make it a more credible find - but
forgot
to lose the S.

Nothing get past your eagle eyes, damn them. :-I

I would hypothesize that the chances of finding a 1909-S VDB in
pocket change are massively larger than finding a 55 Doubled Die,
because they had 24X the mintage, and there are still a lot more
surviving SVDBs, even if half the original mintage has somehow
perished.

James the Actuary

Mmm... That goes to minted population, not circulating population. I
daresay that except for the rare finds from raided/stolen caches, any
circulating 1909 cent was snapped up into long-term storage by the
time we got our high school diplomas. Although most 1955 DD cents
probably have been grabbed off by knowledgeable collectors or are
languishing in the maws of bulk copper penny hoarders, I would think
that an errant 1955 DD has a much longer life expectancy out there in
circulation than a 100-year-old specimen. An obviously old, brown
1909 is going to attract a lot of eyeballs and will quickly be pulled,
even by non-collectors. A middling circulated 1955 strike, single or
double, is not going to do that. I still see 1950s cents mixed into
rolls and change, which is why I changed my post from the VDB to the
DD. The last time I got a 1909 cent of any variety in circulation was
way back when Sister Consommé was drilling the Holy Trinity into my
noggin while visions of filled Whitman folders danced in my head.

While it may be true that a 55DD has a much longer life expectancy in
circulation than an SVDB, the fact remains that the only way one is going
to find either is for, as you say, raided/stolen caches to enter
circulation, and there have to be collectively at least ten SVDBs in
those caches for every 55DD. The trick, of course, is to be that *first*
pair of eyeballs in either case! I never had that good fortune, even
back in nineteen mumbly nine when I was doing Luther's Small Catechism,
while secretly lusting after the female members of the class. Oh, and I,
too, lusted after filled Whitman folders.

James the Doubly Deprived


C'mon guys. You've drifted away from the Toyota topic and started talking
about coins. You're gonna be the cause of more RCC'ers leaving in here a
huff. Or in a Chevy.

Bruce
finder of two 1955 DDO's in 1956.


Damn, what were we thinking, James???

i have a 56 huff ragtop with chrome wheels. it has the small block pcgs holder
with the puce label.
  #247  
Old March 2nd 10, 03:14 PM posted to rec.collecting.coins
Bruce Remick
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 3,391
Default Collecting experience


wrote in message
...
In article , "mazorj"
wrote:

"Bruce Remick" wrote in message
news

"Mr. Jaggers" lugburzman[at]yahoo[dot]com wrote in message
...
mazorj wrote:
"Mr. Jaggers" lugburzman[at]yahoo[dot]com wrote in message
...
mazorj wrote:
"Mr. Jaggers" lugburzman[at]yahoo[dot]com wrote in message
...
mazorj wrote:

...
Damn! I would rate that as the motoring equivalent to finding a
1955-S doubled die cent in change.

1955-*S*???????

James the Gobsmacked

My bad. Originally I wrote it as a 1909-S VDB, then typed over and
deleted some characters to make it a more credible find - but
forgot
to lose the S.

Nothing get past your eagle eyes, damn them. :-I

I would hypothesize that the chances of finding a 1909-S VDB in
pocket change are massively larger than finding a 55 Doubled Die,
because they had 24X the mintage, and there are still a lot more
surviving SVDBs, even if half the original mintage has somehow
perished.

James the Actuary

Mmm... That goes to minted population, not circulating population. I
daresay that except for the rare finds from raided/stolen caches, any
circulating 1909 cent was snapped up into long-term storage by the
time we got our high school diplomas. Although most 1955 DD cents
probably have been grabbed off by knowledgeable collectors or are
languishing in the maws of bulk copper penny hoarders, I would think
that an errant 1955 DD has a much longer life expectancy out there in
circulation than a 100-year-old specimen. An obviously old, brown
1909 is going to attract a lot of eyeballs and will quickly be pulled,
even by non-collectors. A middling circulated 1955 strike, single or
double, is not going to do that. I still see 1950s cents mixed into
rolls and change, which is why I changed my post from the VDB to the
DD. The last time I got a 1909 cent of any variety in circulation was
way back when Sister Consommé was drilling the Holy Trinity into my
noggin while visions of filled Whitman folders danced in my head.

While it may be true that a 55DD has a much longer life expectancy in
circulation than an SVDB, the fact remains that the only way one is
going
to find either is for, as you say, raided/stolen caches to enter
circulation, and there have to be collectively at least ten SVDBs in
those caches for every 55DD. The trick, of course, is to be that
*first*
pair of eyeballs in either case! I never had that good fortune, even
back in nineteen mumbly nine when I was doing Luther's Small Catechism,
while secretly lusting after the female members of the class. Oh, and
I,
too, lusted after filled Whitman folders.

James the Doubly Deprived

C'mon guys. You've drifted away from the Toyota topic and started
talking
about coins. You're gonna be the cause of more RCC'ers leaving in here
a
huff. Or in a Chevy.

Bruce
finder of two 1955 DDO's in 1956.


Damn, what were we thinking, James???

i have a 56 huff ragtop with chrome wheels. it has the small block pcgs
holder
with the puce label.


Are they factory chrome wheels? I suspect the 56-D huff offered them even
though there's no proof. The 56 did come with proof.


  #248  
Old March 2nd 10, 05:56 PM posted to rec.collecting.coins
[email protected]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,172
Default Collecting experience

In article , "Bruce Remick" wrote:

wrote in message
...
In article , "mazorj"
wrote:

"Bruce Remick" wrote in message
news
"Mr. Jaggers" lugburzman[at]yahoo[dot]com wrote in message
...
mazorj wrote:
"Mr. Jaggers" lugburzman[at]yahoo[dot]com wrote in message
...
mazorj wrote:
"Mr. Jaggers" lugburzman[at]yahoo[dot]com wrote in message
...
mazorj wrote:

...
Damn! I would rate that as the motoring equivalent to finding a
1955-S doubled die cent in change.

1955-*S*???????

James the Gobsmacked

My bad. Originally I wrote it as a 1909-S VDB, then typed over and
deleted some characters to make it a more credible find - but
forgot
to lose the S.

Nothing get past your eagle eyes, damn them. :-I

I would hypothesize that the chances of finding a 1909-S VDB in
pocket change are massively larger than finding a 55 Doubled Die,
because they had 24X the mintage, and there are still a lot more
surviving SVDBs, even if half the original mintage has somehow
perished.

James the Actuary

Mmm... That goes to minted population, not circulating population. I
daresay that except for the rare finds from raided/stolen caches, any
circulating 1909 cent was snapped up into long-term storage by the
time we got our high school diplomas. Although most 1955 DD cents
probably have been grabbed off by knowledgeable collectors or are
languishing in the maws of bulk copper penny hoarders, I would think
that an errant 1955 DD has a much longer life expectancy out there in
circulation than a 100-year-old specimen. An obviously old, brown
1909 is going to attract a lot of eyeballs and will quickly be pulled,
even by non-collectors. A middling circulated 1955 strike, single or
double, is not going to do that. I still see 1950s cents mixed into
rolls and change, which is why I changed my post from the VDB to the
DD. The last time I got a 1909 cent of any variety in circulation was
way back when Sister Consommé was drilling the Holy Trinity into my
noggin while visions of filled Whitman folders danced in my head.

While it may be true that a 55DD has a much longer life expectancy in
circulation than an SVDB, the fact remains that the only way one is
going
to find either is for, as you say, raided/stolen caches to enter
circulation, and there have to be collectively at least ten SVDBs in
those caches for every 55DD. The trick, of course, is to be that
*first*
pair of eyeballs in either case! I never had that good fortune, even
back in nineteen mumbly nine when I was doing Luther's Small Catechism,
while secretly lusting after the female members of the class. Oh, and
I,
too, lusted after filled Whitman folders.

James the Doubly Deprived

C'mon guys. You've drifted away from the Toyota topic and started
talking
about coins. You're gonna be the cause of more RCC'ers leaving in here
a
huff. Or in a Chevy.

Bruce
finder of two 1955 DDO's in 1956.

Damn, what were we thinking, James???

i have a 56 huff ragtop with chrome wheels. it has the small block pcgs
holder
with the puce label.


Are they factory chrome wheels? I suspect the 56-D huff offered them even
though there's no proof. The 56 did come with proof.


sadly, they are not oem but tpm.
 




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