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rowe-ami Ti-1 need HELP



 
 
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  #1  
Old June 27th 08, 03:52 PM posted to alt.collecting.juke-boxes
Brutusx
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 8
Default rowe-ami Ti-1 need HELP

I have a Ti-1 Rowe-Ami jukebox and i continue to blow the MDL-6 1/4
fuse ,can not make it through one complete cycle without blowing the
fuse. Any thoughts?
Ads
  #2  
Old June 30th 08, 02:11 AM posted to alt.collecting.juke-boxes
Oldtimejuker
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 92
Default rowe-ami Ti-1 need HELP

On Jun 27, 10:52 am, Brutusx wrote:
I have a Ti-1 Rowe-Ami jukebox and i continue to blow the MDL-6 1/4
fuse ,can not make it through one complete cycle without blowing the
fuse. Any thoughts?


This is the 30 volt AC fuse . There are 4 things in this circuit .
Latch coil in the keyboard, (most likely cause) search unit motor,
magazine motor, (runs the record basket) and the transfer motor (puts
the record on the turntable).
Cheers,Ray
  #3  
Old June 30th 08, 01:23 PM posted to alt.collecting.juke-boxes
kreed
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 376
Default rowe-ami Ti-1 need HELP

On Jun 28, 12:52 am, Brutusx wrote:
I have a Ti-1 Rowe-Ami jukebox and i continue to blow the MDL-6 1/4
fuse ,can not make it through one complete cycle without blowing the
fuse. Any thoughts?


have actually had this exact problem, it turned out to be a magazine
motor that probably had shorted turns. (i just replaced it rather than
repair it as I had plenty of spares on hand at the time). Most of the
time it wouldnt make a full cycle before blowing a fuse. The only
sign of distress was the F***** awful smell coming from it if you got
close enough, also it got hot. Note also that it ran at normal speed
right up to the time of the fuse blowing, it didnt slow down or
buzzzzz or anything.

try putting the switch in "scan" or "rotate" position (cant remember
exactly how it was labelled) and keep rotating the magazine. if this
causes the fuse to fail, or the motor is getting hot, then this is
your problem. Fortunately the motor isnt too hard to rewind. Other
culprits the other poster has listed. The same testing process should
be applied to these, run them continuously without any of the other
running, and when the fuse blows, you know where the culprit is.

While you are at it, thoroughly check all the wires if you have been
working on the machine before this fault started, of if you purchased
it with this fault without knowing if the last owner(s) had been
fiddling with it - as I also had a nasty incident where the cam switch
assembly was removed and replaced by a friend, and a wire was
partially pinched under one of the mounting plate screws. It must
have only shorted a couple of strands, or it must have been a long way
from the supply to where it was - and thin wire maybe ? as it would
actually work for a short time before blowing the fuse. This was a
very frustrating and time consuming fault finding exercise, as it also
caused some weird intermittent faults in the circuit that it was found
in.

  #4  
Old July 1st 08, 12:17 AM posted to alt.collecting.juke-boxes
Brutusx
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 8
Default rowe-ami Ti-1 need HELP

On Jun 30, 8:23*am, kreed wrote:
On Jun 28, 12:52 am, Brutusx wrote:

I have a Ti-1 Rowe-Ami jukebox and i continue to blow the MDL-6 1/4
fuse ,can not make it through one complete cycle without blowing the
fuse. Any thoughts?


have actually had this exact problem, it turned out to be a magazine
motor that probably had shorted turns. (i just replaced it rather than
repair it as I had plenty of spares on hand at the time). Most of the
time it wouldnt make a full cycle before blowing a fuse. *The only
sign of distress was the F***** awful smell coming from it if you got
close enough, also it got hot. *Note also that it ran at normal speed
right up to the time of the fuse blowing, it didnt slow down or
buzzzzz or anything.

try putting the switch in "scan" or "rotate" position (cant remember
exactly how it was labelled) and keep rotating the magazine. *if this
causes the fuse to fail, or the motor is getting hot, then this is
your problem. Fortunately the motor isnt too hard to rewind. * Other
culprits the other poster has listed. *The same testing process should
be applied to these, run them continuously without any of the other
running, and when the fuse blows, you know where the culprit is.

While you are at it, thoroughly check all the wires if you have been
working on the machine before this fault started, of if you purchased
it with this fault without knowing if the last owner(s) had been
fiddling with it - as I also had a nasty incident where the cam switch
assembly was removed and replaced by a friend, and a wire was
partially pinched under one of the mounting plate screws. *It must
have only shorted a couple of strands, or it must have been a long way
from the supply to where it was - and thin wire maybe ? *as it would
actually work for a short time before blowing the fuse. This was a
very frustrating and time consuming fault finding exercise, as it also
caused some weird intermittent faults in the circuit that it was found
in.


Thank you for your help! I can get it to scan with no problem and also
pick a record ,set it down and replace without blowin the fuse. I
found that when i leave the left plug to the circuit board i do not
blow a fuse but as soon as i plug it in the fuse will blow in
seconds.All of the connections appear to be solid as they go to S2
relay. Does that mean the motor is bad? and if so can u even still get
the part? Thank you very much for your time and support !
  #5  
Old July 2nd 08, 06:54 AM posted to alt.collecting.juke-boxes
kreed
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 376
Default rowe-ami Ti-1 need HELP

On Jul 1, 9:17 am, Brutusx wrote:
On Jun 30, 8:23 am, kreed wrote:



On Jun 28, 12:52 am, Brutusx wrote:


I have a Ti-1 Rowe-Ami jukebox and i continue to blow the MDL-6 1/4
fuse ,can not make it through one complete cycle without blowing the
fuse. Any thoughts?


have actually had this exact problem, it turned out to be a magazine
motor that probably had shorted turns. (i just replaced it rather than
repair it as I had plenty of spares on hand at the time). Most of the
time it wouldnt make a full cycle before blowing a fuse. The only
sign of distress was the F***** awful smell coming from it if you got
close enough, also it got hot. Note also that it ran at normal speed
right up to the time of the fuse blowing, it didnt slow down or
buzzzzz or anything.


try putting the switch in "scan" or "rotate" position (cant remember
exactly how it was labelled) and keep rotating the magazine. if this
causes the fuse to fail, or the motor is getting hot, then this is
your problem. Fortunately the motor isnt too hard to rewind. Other
culprits the other poster has listed. The same testing process should
be applied to these, run them continuously without any of the other
running, and when the fuse blows, you know where the culprit is.


While you are at it, thoroughly check all the wires if you have been
working on the machine before this fault started, of if you purchased
it with this fault without knowing if the last owner(s) had been
fiddling with it - as I also had a nasty incident where the cam switch
assembly was removed and replaced by a friend, and a wire was
partially pinched under one of the mounting plate screws. It must
have only shorted a couple of strands, or it must have been a long way
from the supply to where it was - and thin wire maybe ? as it would
actually work for a short time before blowing the fuse. This was a
very frustrating and time consuming fault finding exercise, as it also
caused some weird intermittent faults in the circuit that it was found
in.


Thank you for your help! I can get it to scan with no problem and also
pick a record ,set it down and replace without blowin the fuse. I
found that when i leave the left plug to the circuit board i do not
blow a fuse but as soon as i plug it in the fuse will blow in
seconds.All of the connections appear to be solid as they go to S2
relay. Does that mean the motor is bad? and if so can u even still get
the part? Thank you very much for your time and support !


which circuit board - search unit ? if it blows when you connect it
there is something wrong in there. While it may be the motor, it could
be a short circuit anywhere in the 28v lines in the search unit.

It could also be the latch bar solenoid, as I think (from memory) that
the search unit needs to be connected for this to work. To test this,
make sure the credits are zero so as the latch solenoid isnt
operational (it holds in whenever there is credit in the machine).
Unplugging the connector from the credit unit is probably the best way
to ensure there isnt credit.

Another way to test this is to hold down the relay in the button bank
that switches the latch bar coil. (determine which one by tracing wire
colours from relay contacts to latch coil) I dont think that the
search unit needs to be connected for this test, so leave it
disconnected when doing this. If the fuse blows, then you know its not
the search motor. if the coil never energises, then you will have to
further investigate why.

The search motor should only ever get power when a letter and a number
button are held in (and there is sufficient credit).






  #6  
Old July 5th 08, 10:02 AM posted to alt.collecting.juke-boxes
kreed
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 376
Default rowe-ami Ti-1 need HELP

On Jul 2, 3:54 pm, kreed wrote:
On Jul 1, 9:17 am, Brutusx wrote:



On Jun 30, 8:23 am, kreed wrote:


On Jun 28, 12:52 am, Brutusx wrote:


I have a Ti-1 Rowe-Ami jukebox and i continue to blow the MDL-6 1/4
fuse ,can not make it through one complete cycle without blowing the
fuse. Any thoughts?


have actually had this exact problem, it turned out to be a magazine
motor that probably had shorted turns. (i just replaced it rather than
repair it as I had plenty of spares on hand at the time). Most of the
time it wouldnt make a full cycle before blowing a fuse. The only
sign of distress was the F***** awful smell coming from it if you got
close enough, also it got hot. Note also that it ran at normal speed
right up to the time of the fuse blowing, it didnt slow down or
buzzzzz or anything.


try putting the switch in "scan" or "rotate" position (cant remember
exactly how it was labelled) and keep rotating the magazine. if this
causes the fuse to fail, or the motor is getting hot, then this is
your problem. Fortunately the motor isnt too hard to rewind. Other
culprits the other poster has listed. The same testing process should
be applied to these, run them continuously without any of the other
running, and when the fuse blows, you know where the culprit is.


While you are at it, thoroughly check all the wires if you have been
working on the machine before this fault started, of if you purchased
it with this fault without knowing if the last owner(s) had been
fiddling with it - as I also had a nasty incident where the cam switch
assembly was removed and replaced by a friend, and a wire was
partially pinched under one of the mounting plate screws. It must
have only shorted a couple of strands, or it must have been a long way
from the supply to where it was - and thin wire maybe ? as it would
actually work for a short time before blowing the fuse. This was a
very frustrating and time consuming fault finding exercise, as it also
caused some weird intermittent faults in the circuit that it was found
in.


Thank you for your help! I can get it to scan with no problem and also
pick a record ,set it down and replace without blowin the fuse. I
found that when i leave the left plug to the circuit board i do not
blow a fuse but as soon as i plug it in the fuse will blow in
seconds.All of the connections appear to be solid as they go to S2
relay. Does that mean the motor is bad? and if so can u even still get
the part? Thank you very much for your time and support !


which circuit board - search unit ? if it blows when you connect it
there is something wrong in there. While it may be the motor, it could
be a short circuit anywhere in the 28v lines in the search unit.

It could also be the latch bar solenoid, as I think (from memory) that
the search unit needs to be connected for this to work. To test this,
make sure the credits are zero so as the latch solenoid isnt
operational (it holds in whenever there is credit in the machine).
Unplugging the connector from the credit unit is probably the best way
to ensure there isnt credit.

Another way to test this is to hold down the relay in the button bank
that switches the latch bar coil. (determine which one by tracing wire
colours from relay contacts to latch coil) I dont think that the
search unit needs to be connected for this test, so leave it
disconnected when doing this. If the fuse blows, then you know its not
the search motor. if the coil never energises, then you will have to
further investigate why.

The search motor should only ever get power when a letter and a number
button are held in (and there is sufficient credit).


--------------

Actually you are luckier than some.
I was just mentioning this problem of yours to a collegue, who
reminded me of a RI - 1 (A US imported one and the only one that i had
ever seen here) that I reconditioned the mech for him about 18 years
back, that had never worked properly for some unknown reason, and
found out that the main reason was that some fool in the past had
tried to work on it using a candle for illumination, and managed to
drip candle wax all through the search unit, other parts and on the
front of the machine, where it permanently discoloured the metal
extrusions that form the front of the machine. It also played havoc
with relay and search wiper contacts where it fell too.

That was a real **** of a job to clean it all out, but we did it, and
the machine worked perfectly for some years after until it was sold
and dropped out of our sight .

Other than not holding the full 100 records, these and RI-2 were a
good little machine for the tight spots, looked good, and had great
sound (for their size) to boot.
  #7  
Old July 12th 08, 01:48 AM posted to alt.collecting.juke-boxes
Brutusx
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 8
Default rowe-ami Ti-1 need HELP

On Jul 5, 5:02*am, kreed wrote:
On Jul 2, 3:54 pm, kreed wrote:





On Jul 1, 9:17 am, Brutusx wrote:


On Jun 30, 8:23 am, kreed wrote:


On Jun 28, 12:52 am, Brutusx wrote:


I have a Ti-1 Rowe-Ami jukebox and i continue to blow the MDL-6 1/4
fuse ,can not make it through one complete cycle without blowing the
fuse. Any thoughts?


have actually had this exact problem, it turned out to be a magazine
motor that probably had shorted turns. (i just replaced it rather than
repair it as I had plenty of spares on hand at the time). Most of the
time it wouldnt make a full cycle before blowing a fuse. *The only
sign of distress was the F***** awful smell coming from it if you got
close enough, also it got hot. *Note also that it ran at normal speed
right up to the time of the fuse blowing, it didnt slow down or
buzzzzz or anything.


try putting the switch in "scan" or "rotate" position (cant remember
exactly how it was labelled) and keep rotating the magazine. *if this
causes the fuse to fail, or the motor is getting hot, then this is
your problem. Fortunately the motor isnt too hard to rewind. * Other
culprits the other poster has listed. *The same testing process should
be applied to these, run them continuously without any of the other
running, and when the fuse blows, you know where the culprit is.


While you are at it, thoroughly check all the wires if you have been
working on the machine before this fault started, of if you purchased
it with this fault without knowing if the last owner(s) had been
fiddling with it - as I also had a nasty incident where the cam switch
assembly was removed and replaced by a friend, and a wire was
partially pinched under one of the mounting plate screws. *It must
have only shorted a couple of strands, or it must have been a long way
from the supply to where it was - and thin wire maybe ? *as it would
actually work for a short time before blowing the fuse. This was a
very frustrating and time consuming fault finding exercise, as it also
caused some weird intermittent faults in the circuit that it was found
in.


Thank you for your help! I can get it to scan with no problem and also
pick a record ,set it down and replace without blowin the fuse. I
found that when i leave the left plug to the circuit board i do not
blow a fuse but as soon as i plug it in the fuse will blow in
seconds.All of the connections appear to be solid as they go to S2
relay. Does that mean the motor is bad? and if so can u even still get
the part? Thank you very much for your time and support !


which circuit board - search unit ? * if it blows when you connect it
there is something wrong in there. While it may be the motor, it could
be a short circuit anywhere in the 28v lines in the search unit.


It could also be the latch bar solenoid, as I think (from memory) that
the search unit needs to be connected for this to work. To test this,
make sure the credits are zero so as the latch solenoid isnt
operational (it holds in whenever there is credit in the machine).
Unplugging the connector from the credit unit is probably the best way
to ensure there isnt credit.


Another way to test this is to hold down the relay in the button bank
that switches the latch bar coil. (determine which one by tracing wire
colours from relay contacts to latch coil) *I dont think that the
search unit needs to be connected for this test, so leave it
disconnected when doing this. If the fuse blows, then you know its not
the search motor. if the coil never energises, then you will have to
further investigate why.


The search motor should only ever get power when a letter and a number
button are held in (and there is sufficient credit).


--------------

Actually you are luckier than some.
I was just mentioning this problem of yours to a collegue, who
reminded me of a RI - 1 (A US imported one and the only one that i had
ever seen here) that I reconditioned the mech for him about 18 years
back, that had never worked properly for some unknown reason, and
found out that the main reason was that some fool in the past had
tried to work on it using a candle for illumination, and managed to
drip candle wax all through the search unit, other parts and on the
front of the machine, where it permanently discoloured the metal
extrusions that form the front of the machine. It also played havoc
with relay and search wiper contacts where it fell too.

That was a real **** of a job to clean it all out, but we did it, and
the machine worked perfectly for some years after until it was sold
and dropped out of our sight .

Other than not holding the full 100 records, these and RI-2 were a
good little machine for the tight spots, looked good, and had great
sound (for their size) to boot.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -


Thanks for all the info! Well i think i have it narrowed down to the
solenoid @ the latch coil? But would that also cause the fuse to blow
when the 3rd plug is plugged into the board? Do you know where i can
locate a solenoid? having trouble finding one ! Thanks again i
would still be scratchin my head if it wasnt for your insight
  #8  
Old July 12th 08, 09:10 AM posted to alt.collecting.juke-boxes
kreed
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 376
Default rowe-ami Ti-1 need HELP

On Jul 12, 10:48 am, Brutusx wrote:
On Jul 5, 5:02 am, kreed wrote:



On Jul 2, 3:54 pm, kreed wrote:


On Jul 1, 9:17 am, Brutusx wrote:


On Jun 30, 8:23 am, kreed wrote:


On Jun 28, 12:52 am, Brutusx wrote:


I have a Ti-1 Rowe-Ami jukebox and i continue to blow the MDL-6 1/4
fuse ,can not make it through one complete cycle without blowing the
fuse. Any thoughts?


have actually had this exact problem, it turned out to be a magazine
motor that probably had shorted turns. (i just replaced it rather than
repair it as I had plenty of spares on hand at the time). Most of the
time it wouldnt make a full cycle before blowing a fuse. The only
sign of distress was the F***** awful smell coming from it if you got
close enough, also it got hot. Note also that it ran at normal speed
right up to the time of the fuse blowing, it didnt slow down or
buzzzzz or anything.


try putting the switch in "scan" or "rotate" position (cant remember
exactly how it was labelled) and keep rotating the magazine. if this
causes the fuse to fail, or the motor is getting hot, then this is
your problem. Fortunately the motor isnt too hard to rewind. Other
culprits the other poster has listed. The same testing process should
be applied to these, run them continuously without any of the other
running, and when the fuse blows, you know where the culprit is.


While you are at it, thoroughly check all the wires if you have been
working on the machine before this fault started, of if you purchased
it with this fault without knowing if the last owner(s) had been
fiddling with it - as I also had a nasty incident where the cam switch
assembly was removed and replaced by a friend, and a wire was
partially pinched under one of the mounting plate screws. It must
have only shorted a couple of strands, or it must have been a long way
from the supply to where it was - and thin wire maybe ? as it would
actually work for a short time before blowing the fuse. This was a
very frustrating and time consuming fault finding exercise, as it also
caused some weird intermittent faults in the circuit that it was found
in.


Thank you for your help! I can get it to scan with no problem and also
pick a record ,set it down and replace without blowin the fuse. I
found that when i leave the left plug to the circuit board i do not
blow a fuse but as soon as i plug it in the fuse will blow in
seconds.All of the connections appear to be solid as they go to S2
relay. Does that mean the motor is bad? and if so can u even still get
the part? Thank you very much for your time and support !


which circuit board - search unit ? if it blows when you connect it
there is something wrong in there. While it may be the motor, it could
be a short circuit anywhere in the 28v lines in the search unit.


It could also be the latch bar solenoid, as I think (from memory) that
the search unit needs to be connected for this to work. To test this,
make sure the credits are zero so as the latch solenoid isnt
operational (it holds in whenever there is credit in the machine).
Unplugging the connector from the credit unit is probably the best way
to ensure there isnt credit.


Another way to test this is to hold down the relay in the button bank
that switches the latch bar coil. (determine which one by tracing wire
colours from relay contacts to latch coil) I dont think that the
search unit needs to be connected for this test, so leave it
disconnected when doing this. If the fuse blows, then you know its not
the search motor. if the coil never energises, then you will have to
further investigate why.


The search motor should only ever get power when a letter and a number
button are held in (and there is sufficient credit).


--------------


Actually you are luckier than some.
I was just mentioning this problem of yours to a collegue, who
reminded me of a RI - 1 (A US imported one and the only one that i had
ever seen here) that I reconditioned the mech for him about 18 years
back, that had never worked properly for some unknown reason, and
found out that the main reason was that some fool in the past had
tried to work on it using a candle for illumination, and managed to
drip candle wax all through the search unit, other parts and on the
front of the machine, where it permanently discoloured the metal
extrusions that form the front of the machine. It also played havoc
with relay and search wiper contacts where it fell too.


That was a real **** of a job to clean it all out, but we did it, and
the machine worked perfectly for some years after until it was sold
and dropped out of our sight .


Other than not holding the full 100 records, these and RI-2 were a
good little machine for the tight spots, looked good, and had great
sound (for their size) to boot.- Hide quoted text -


- Show quoted text -


Thanks for all the info! Well i think i have it narrowed down to the
solenoid @ the latch coil? But would that also cause the fuse to blow
when the 3rd plug is plugged into the board? Do you know where i can
locate a solenoid? having trouble finding one ! Thanks again i
would still be scratchin my head if it wasnt for your insight


I doubt you would find a solenoid anywhere these days, as there werent
as many of these machines produced as the 200 selection units (had a
different solenoid as they had a different keyboard). You probably
have to go to a transformer or motor rewinding specialist and have it
re-wound.

First though, I would remove the connectors from the solenoid,
(insulate so they dont touch the chassis) and try and see if the fuse
still blows, if it does I would check other parts of the circuit for
any shorts to chassis or gnd. (relay contacts may have foreign matter
on them or might be touching against something for example. Not
likely but possible.

which is the 3rd plug you refer to ? search unit ? The search unit
has to be connected to the machine for the latch solenoid to operate.
Try disconnecting the wire from the solenoid and see if the fuse still
blows with solenoid out of circuit.

The search unit only operates the latch solenoid through the latch
relay in the button bank, it is switched by the 24vdc system to the
search unit, (and via the cabinet harness to the credit unit.)

The only reason that 28vac comes to the search unit is for the search
motor, but it does go through several switches on the way to it.
Part of this circuit is via the buttons, 28vac will be supplied when
ANY letter AND ANY number button are held in together. If needed,
check for any shorts or foreign matter around the button bank wiring
too.


Its confusing to explain, a manual with a wiring diagram might be a
good idea for you to get.
  #9  
Old July 12th 08, 04:25 PM posted to alt.collecting.juke-boxes
Brutusx
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 8
Default rowe-ami Ti-1 need HELP

On Jul 12, 4:10*am, kreed wrote:
On Jul 12, 10:48 am, Brutusx wrote:





On Jul 5, 5:02 am, kreed wrote:


On Jul 2, 3:54 pm, kreed wrote:


On Jul 1, 9:17 am, Brutusx wrote:


On Jun 30, 8:23 am, kreed wrote:


On Jun 28, 12:52 am, Brutusx wrote:


I have a Ti-1 Rowe-Ami jukebox and i continue to blow the MDL-6 1/4
fuse ,can not make it through one complete cycle without blowing the
fuse. Any thoughts?


have actually had this exact problem, it turned out to be a magazine
motor that probably had shorted turns. (i just replaced it rather than
repair it as I had plenty of spares on hand at the time). Most of the
time it wouldnt make a full cycle before blowing a fuse. *The only
sign of distress was the F***** awful smell coming from it if you got
close enough, also it got hot. *Note also that it ran at normal speed
right up to the time of the fuse blowing, it didnt slow down or
buzzzzz or anything.


try putting the switch in "scan" or "rotate" position (cant remember
exactly how it was labelled) and keep rotating the magazine. *if this
causes the fuse to fail, or the motor is getting hot, then this is
your problem. Fortunately the motor isnt too hard to rewind. * Other
culprits the other poster has listed. *The same testing process should
be applied to these, run them continuously without any of the other
running, and when the fuse blows, you know where the culprit is..


While you are at it, thoroughly check all the wires if you have been
working on the machine before this fault started, of if you purchased
it with this fault without knowing if the last owner(s) had been
fiddling with it - as I also had a nasty incident where the cam switch
assembly was removed and replaced by a friend, and a wire was
partially pinched under one of the mounting plate screws. *It must
have only shorted a couple of strands, or it must have been a long way
from the supply to where it was - and thin wire maybe ? *as it would
actually work for a short time before blowing the fuse. This was a
very frustrating and time consuming fault finding exercise, as it also
caused some weird intermittent faults in the circuit that it was found
in.


Thank you for your help! I can get it to scan with no problem and also
pick a record ,set it down and replace without blowin the fuse. I
found that when i leave the left plug to the circuit board i do not
blow a fuse but as soon as i plug it in the fuse will blow in
seconds.All of the connections appear to be solid as they go to S2
relay. Does that mean the motor is bad? and if so can u even still get
the part? Thank you very much for your time and support !


which circuit board - search unit ? * if it blows when you connect it
there is something wrong in there. While it may be the motor, it could
be a short circuit anywhere in the 28v lines in the search unit.


It could also be the latch bar solenoid, as I think (from memory) that
the search unit needs to be connected for this to work. To test this,
make sure the credits are zero so as the latch solenoid isnt
operational (it holds in whenever there is credit in the machine).
Unplugging the connector from the credit unit is probably the best way
to ensure there isnt credit.


Another way to test this is to hold down the relay in the button bank
that switches the latch bar coil. (determine which one by tracing wire
colours from relay contacts to latch coil) *I dont think that the
search unit needs to be connected for this test, so leave it
disconnected when doing this. If the fuse blows, then you know its not
the search motor. if the coil never energises, then you will have to
further investigate why.


The search motor should only ever get power when a letter and a number
button are held in (and there is sufficient credit).


--------------


Actually you are luckier than some.
I was just mentioning this problem of yours to a collegue, who
reminded me of a RI - 1 (A US imported one and the only one that i had
ever seen here) that I reconditioned the mech for him about 18 years
back, that had never worked properly for some unknown reason, and
found out that the main reason was that some fool in the past had
tried to work on it using a candle for illumination, and managed to
drip candle wax all through the search unit, other parts and on the
front of the machine, where it permanently discoloured the metal
extrusions that form the front of the machine. It also played havoc
with relay and search wiper contacts where it fell too.


That was a real **** of a job to clean it all out, but we did it, and
the machine worked perfectly for some years after until it was sold
and dropped out of our sight .


Other than not holding the full 100 records, these and RI-2 were a
good little machine for the tight spots, looked good, and had great
sound (for their size) to boot.- Hide quoted text -


- Show quoted text -


Thanks for all the info! Well i think i have it narrowed down to the
solenoid @ the latch coil? But would that also cause the fuse to blow
when the 3rd plug is plugged into the board? Do you know where i can
locate a solenoid? having trouble finding one ! * *Thanks again i
would still be scratchin my head if it wasnt for your insight


I doubt you would find a solenoid anywhere these days, as there werent
as many of these machines produced as the 200 selection units (had a
different solenoid as they had a different keyboard). *You probably
have to go to a transformer or motor rewinding specialist and have it
re-wound.

First though, I would remove the connectors from the solenoid,
(insulate so they dont touch the chassis) and try and see if the fuse
still blows, *if it does I would check other parts of the circuit for
any shorts to chassis or gnd. (relay contacts may have foreign matter
on them or might be touching against something for example. *Not
likely but possible.

which is the 3rd plug you refer to ? *search unit ? *The search unit
has to be connected to the machine for the latch solenoid to operate.
Try disconnecting the wire from the solenoid and see if the fuse still
blows with solenoid out of circuit.

The search unit only operates the latch solenoid through the latch
relay in the button bank, it is switched by the 24vdc system to the
search unit, (and via the cabinet harness to the credit unit.)

The only reason that 28vac comes to the search unit is for the search
motor, but it does go through several switches on the way to it.
Part of this circuit is via the buttons, 28vac will be supplied when
ANY letter AND ANY number button are held in together. *If needed,
check for any shorts or foreign matter around the button bank wiring
too.

Its confusing to explain, a manual with a wiring diagram might be a
good idea for you to get.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -


Well I tried to unplug the solenoid and when i do it does not blow the
fuse.So that should narrow it down to the solenoid...right?
  #10  
Old July 13th 08, 10:13 AM posted to alt.collecting.juke-boxes
kreed
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 376
Default rowe-ami Ti-1 need HELP

On Jul 13, 1:25 am, Brutusx wrote:
On Jul 12, 4:10 am, kreed wrote:



On Jul 12, 10:48 am, Brutusx wrote:


On Jul 5, 5:02 am, kreed wrote:


On Jul 2, 3:54 pm, kreed wrote:


On Jul 1, 9:17 am, Brutusx wrote:


On Jun 30, 8:23 am, kreed wrote:


On Jun 28, 12:52 am, Brutusx wrote:


I have a Ti-1 Rowe-Ami jukebox and i continue to blow the MDL-6 1/4
fuse ,can not make it through one complete cycle without blowing the
fuse. Any thoughts?


have actually had this exact problem, it turned out to be a magazine
motor that probably had shorted turns. (i just replaced it rather than
repair it as I had plenty of spares on hand at the time). Most of the
time it wouldnt make a full cycle before blowing a fuse. The only
sign of distress was the F***** awful smell coming from it if you got
close enough, also it got hot. Note also that it ran at normal speed
right up to the time of the fuse blowing, it didnt slow down or
buzzzzz or anything.


try putting the switch in "scan" or "rotate" position (cant remember
exactly how it was labelled) and keep rotating the magazine. if this
causes the fuse to fail, or the motor is getting hot, then this is
your problem. Fortunately the motor isnt too hard to rewind. Other
culprits the other poster has listed. The same testing process should
be applied to these, run them continuously without any of the other
running, and when the fuse blows, you know where the culprit is.


While you are at it, thoroughly check all the wires if you have been
working on the machine before this fault started, of if you purchased
it with this fault without knowing if the last owner(s) had been
fiddling with it - as I also had a nasty incident where the cam switch
assembly was removed and replaced by a friend, and a wire was
partially pinched under one of the mounting plate screws. It must
have only shorted a couple of strands, or it must have been a long way
from the supply to where it was - and thin wire maybe ? as it would
actually work for a short time before blowing the fuse. This was a
very frustrating and time consuming fault finding exercise, as it also
caused some weird intermittent faults in the circuit that it was found
in.


Thank you for your help! I can get it to scan with no problem and also
pick a record ,set it down and replace without blowin the fuse. I
found that when i leave the left plug to the circuit board i do not
blow a fuse but as soon as i plug it in the fuse will blow in
seconds.All of the connections appear to be solid as they go to S2
relay. Does that mean the motor is bad? and if so can u even still get
the part? Thank you very much for your time and support !


which circuit board - search unit ? if it blows when you connect it
there is something wrong in there. While it may be the motor, it could
be a short circuit anywhere in the 28v lines in the search unit.


It could also be the latch bar solenoid, as I think (from memory) that
the search unit needs to be connected for this to work. To test this,
make sure the credits are zero so as the latch solenoid isnt
operational (it holds in whenever there is credit in the machine).
Unplugging the connector from the credit unit is probably the best way
to ensure there isnt credit.


Another way to test this is to hold down the relay in the button bank
that switches the latch bar coil. (determine which one by tracing wire
colours from relay contacts to latch coil) I dont think that the
search unit needs to be connected for this test, so leave it
disconnected when doing this. If the fuse blows, then you know its not
the search motor. if the coil never energises, then you will have to
further investigate why.


The search motor should only ever get power when a letter and a number
button are held in (and there is sufficient credit).


--------------


Actually you are luckier than some.
I was just mentioning this problem of yours to a collegue, who
reminded me of a RI - 1 (A US imported one and the only one that i had
ever seen here) that I reconditioned the mech for him about 18 years
back, that had never worked properly for some unknown reason, and
found out that the main reason was that some fool in the past had
tried to work on it using a candle for illumination, and managed to
drip candle wax all through the search unit, other parts and on the
front of the machine, where it permanently discoloured the metal
extrusions that form the front of the machine. It also played havoc
with relay and search wiper contacts where it fell too.


That was a real **** of a job to clean it all out, but we did it, and
the machine worked perfectly for some years after until it was sold
and dropped out of our sight .


Other than not holding the full 100 records, these and RI-2 were a
good little machine for the tight spots, looked good, and had great
sound (for their size) to boot.- Hide quoted text -


- Show quoted text -


Thanks for all the info! Well i think i have it narrowed down to the
solenoid @ the latch coil? But would that also cause the fuse to blow
when the 3rd plug is plugged into the board? Do you know where i can
locate a solenoid? having trouble finding one ! Thanks again i
would still be scratchin my head if it wasnt for your insight


I doubt you would find a solenoid anywhere these days, as there werent
as many of these machines produced as the 200 selection units (had a
different solenoid as they had a different keyboard). You probably
have to go to a transformer or motor rewinding specialist and have it
re-wound.


First though, I would remove the connectors from the solenoid,
(insulate so they dont touch the chassis) and try and see if the fuse
still blows, if it does I would check other parts of the circuit for
any shorts to chassis or gnd. (relay contacts may have foreign matter
on them or might be touching against something for example. Not
likely but possible.


which is the 3rd plug you refer to ? search unit ? The search unit
has to be connected to the machine for the latch solenoid to operate.
Try disconnecting the wire from the solenoid and see if the fuse still
blows with solenoid out of circuit.


The search unit only operates the latch solenoid through the latch
relay in the button bank, it is switched by the 24vdc system to the
search unit, (and via the cabinet harness to the credit unit.)


The only reason that 28vac comes to the search unit is for the search
motor, but it does go through several switches on the way to it.
Part of this circuit is via the buttons, 28vac will be supplied when
ANY letter AND ANY number button are held in together. If needed,
check for any shorts or foreign matter around the button bank wiring
too.


Its confusing to explain, a manual with a wiring diagram might be a
good idea for you to get.- Hide quoted text -


- Show quoted text -


Well I tried to unplug the solenoid and when i do it does not blow the
fuse.So that should narrow it down to the solenoid...right?


Its the solenoid then.


 




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