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PCGS and Their "Questionable Color" Ripoff



 
 
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  #1  
Old January 16th 10, 04:00 AM posted to rec.collecting.coins
reality
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 349
Default PCGS and Their "Questionable Color" Ripoff

What is the deal with this nonsense?

When I submit a coin to PCGS, I want to know if it is genuine, the
grade, and if it is original.

IMO if you are paying the supposed leading expert graders in the
industry a $30 grading fee plus shipping both ways, then their
"Genuine - Questionable Color" B.S is not an option. I'm paying them
to tell me one way or the other.

The color/toning is either ORIGINAL or NOT.

If they can't tell the difference, then what is their opinion worth?
IMO the grading fee should be refunded if their "experts" can't
discern the difference. It's a total ripoff otherwise.
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  #2  
Old January 16th 10, 04:10 AM posted to rec.collecting.coins
Bruce Remick
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 3,391
Default PCGS and Their "Questionable Color" Ripoff


"Reality" wrote in message
...
What is the deal with this nonsense?

When I submit a coin to PCGS, I want to know if it is genuine, the
grade, and if it is original.

IMO if you are paying the supposed leading expert graders in the
industry a $30 grading fee plus shipping both ways, then their
"Genuine - Questionable Color" B.S is not an option. I'm paying them
to tell me one way or the other.

The color/toning is either ORIGINAL or NOT.

If they can't tell the difference, then what is their opinion worth?
IMO the grading fee should be refunded if their "experts" can't
discern the difference. It's a total ripoff otherwise.


Tell 'em we said to give you your money back. It's much less stressful to
buy coins already graded by PCGS (and paid for by someone else) than to send
them your own coins and hold your breath waiting.


  #3  
Old January 16th 10, 04:42 AM posted to rec.collecting.coins
reality
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 349
Default PCGS and Their "Questionable Color" Ripoff

On Jan 15, 8:10*pm, "Bruce Remick" wrote:
"Reality" wrote in message

...

What is the deal with this nonsense?


When I submit a coin to PCGS, I want to know if it is genuine, the
grade, and if it is original.


IMO if you are paying the supposed leading expert graders in the
industry a $30 grading fee plus shipping both ways, then their
"Genuine - Questionable Color" B.S is not an option. *I'm paying them
to tell me one way or the other.


The color/toning is either ORIGINAL or NOT.


If they can't tell the difference, then what is their opinion worth?
IMO the grading fee should be refunded if their "experts" can't
discern the difference. *It's a total ripoff otherwise.


Tell 'em we said to give you your money back. *It's much less stressful to
buy coins already graded by PCGS (and paid for by someone else) than to send
them your own coins and hold your breath waiting.


The point is, why should *anyone* get ripped off in that manner?
  #4  
Old January 16th 10, 01:35 PM posted to rec.collecting.coins
oly
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 3,111
Default PCGS and Their "Questionable Color" Ripoff

On Jan 15, 10:42*pm, Reality wrote:
On Jan 15, 8:10*pm, "Bruce Remick" wrote:





"Reality" wrote in message


...


What is the deal with this nonsense?


When I submit a coin to PCGS, I want to know if it is genuine, the
grade, and if it is original.


IMO if you are paying the supposed leading expert graders in the
industry a $30 grading fee plus shipping both ways, then their
"Genuine - Questionable Color" B.S is not an option. *I'm paying them
to tell me one way or the other.


The color/toning is either ORIGINAL or NOT.


If they can't tell the difference, then what is their opinion worth?
IMO the grading fee should be refunded if their "experts" can't
discern the difference. *It's a total ripoff otherwise.


Tell 'em we said to give you your money back. *It's much less stressful to
buy coins already graded by PCGS (and paid for by someone else) than to send
them your own coins and hold your breath waiting.


The point is, why should *anyone* get ripped off in that manner?- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -


If you play cards for half-an-hour and can't figure out who the patsy
is, you're the patsy.

oly
  #5  
Old January 16th 10, 02:29 PM posted to rec.collecting.coins
Bruce Remick
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 3,391
Default PCGS and Their "Questionable Color" Ripoff


"Reality" wrote in message
...
On Jan 15, 8:10 pm, "Bruce Remick" wrote:
"Reality" wrote in message

...

What is the deal with this nonsense?


When I submit a coin to PCGS, I want to know if it is genuine, the
grade, and if it is original.


IMO if you are paying the supposed leading expert graders in the
industry a $30 grading fee plus shipping both ways, then their
"Genuine - Questionable Color" B.S is not an option. I'm paying them
to tell me one way or the other.


The color/toning is either ORIGINAL or NOT.


If they can't tell the difference, then what is their opinion worth?
IMO the grading fee should be refunded if their "experts" can't
discern the difference. It's a total ripoff otherwise.


Tell 'em we said to give you your money back. It's much less stressful to
buy coins already graded by PCGS (and paid for by someone else) than to
send
them your own coins and hold your breath waiting.


The point is, why should *anyone* get ripped off in that manner?
===========

If you do some homework first, you're less likely to get "ripped off".
Sending a coin to a TPG like PCGS can be a crapshoot unless you're someone
who's experienced with that sort of thing. Before spending that money maybe
it would have saved any disappointment if you'd showed the coin first to a
couple reputable dealers who might have cautioned you about your coin's
questionable color and how PCGS might respond to it. You didn't say if you
did submit the coin through a dealer or if you're a "member". If it was
through a dealer, maybe you've got a gripe with that dealer for not advising
you as to what PCGS might conclude.

No one should get ripped off in that manner, and there are many ways to
minimize the chance.



  #6  
Old January 16th 10, 02:56 PM posted to rec.collecting.coins
oly
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 3,111
Default PCGS and Their "Questionable Color" Ripoff

On Jan 16, 8:29*am, "Bruce Remick" wrote:
"Reality" wrote in message

...
On Jan 15, 8:10 pm, "Bruce Remick" wrote:





"Reality" wrote in message


...


What is the deal with this nonsense?


When I submit a coin to PCGS, I want to know if it is genuine, the
grade, and if it is original.


IMO if you are paying the supposed leading expert graders in the
industry a $30 grading fee plus shipping both ways, then their
"Genuine - Questionable Color" B.S is not an option. I'm paying them
to tell me one way or the other.


The color/toning is either ORIGINAL or NOT.


If they can't tell the difference, then what is their opinion worth?
IMO the grading fee should be refunded if their "experts" can't
discern the difference. It's a total ripoff otherwise.


Tell 'em we said to give you your money back. It's much less stressful to
buy coins already graded by PCGS (and paid for by someone else) than to
send
them your own coins and hold your breath waiting.


The point is, why should *anyone* get ripped off in that manner?
===========

If you do some homework first, you're less likely to get "ripped off".
Sending a coin to a TPG like PCGS can be a crapshoot unless you're someone
who's experienced with that sort of thing. *Before spending that money maybe
it would have saved any disappointment if you'd showed the coin first to a
couple reputable dealers who might have cautioned you about your coin's
questionable color and how PCGS might respond to it. *You didn't say if you
did submit the coin through a dealer or if you're a "member". *If it was
through a dealer, maybe you've got a gripe with that dealer for not advising
you as to what PCGS might conclude.

No one should get ripped off in that manner, and there are many ways to
minimize the chance.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -


Bruce, your first advice was very adequate (i.e., buy a decent piece,
sightseen, already slabbed); that's not the game the OP wants to play.

oly
  #7  
Old January 16th 10, 06:32 PM posted to rec.collecting.coins
reality
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 349
Default PCGS and Their "Questionable Color" Ripoff

On Jan 16, 6:29*am, "Bruce Remick" wrote:
"Reality" wrote in message

...
On Jan 15, 8:10 pm, "Bruce Remick" wrote:





"Reality" wrote in message


...


What is the deal with this nonsense?


When I submit a coin to PCGS, I want to know if it is genuine, the
grade, and if it is original.


IMO if you are paying the supposed leading expert graders in the
industry a $30 grading fee plus shipping both ways, then their
"Genuine - Questionable Color" B.S is not an option. I'm paying them
to tell me one way or the other.


The color/toning is either ORIGINAL or NOT.


If they can't tell the difference, then what is their opinion worth?
IMO the grading fee should be refunded if their "experts" can't
discern the difference. It's a total ripoff otherwise.


Tell 'em we said to give you your money back. It's much less stressful to
buy coins already graded by PCGS (and paid for by someone else) than to
send
them your own coins and hold your breath waiting.


The point is, why should *anyone* get ripped off in that manner?
===========

If you do some homework first, you're less likely to get "ripped off".
Sending a coin to a TPG like PCGS can be a crapshoot unless you're someone
who's experienced with that sort of thing. *Before spending that money maybe
it would have saved any disappointment if you'd showed the coin first to a
couple reputable dealers who might have cautioned you about your coin's
questionable color and how PCGS might respond to it. *You didn't say if you
did submit the coin through a dealer or if you're a "member". *If it was
through a dealer, maybe you've got a gripe with that dealer for not advising
you as to what PCGS might conclude.

No one should get ripped off in that manner, and there are many ways to
minimize the chance.


I sent it in through a very experienced dealer. The coin was an 1882-
CC PL Morgan Dollar with rainbow toning. I bought the coin from
another reputable dealer over 20 years ago and it has been in my safe
deposit box since. No one at the shop had any problems with it and
neither did I.

My question is why didn't PCGS just say that their opinion was that
the coin was recolored? (They would be wrong BTW.)
  #8  
Old January 16th 10, 06:35 PM posted to rec.collecting.coins
reality
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 349
Default PCGS and Their "Questionable Color" Ripoff

On Jan 16, 6:56*am, oly wrote:
On Jan 16, 8:29*am, "Bruce Remick" wrote:





"Reality" wrote in message


...
On Jan 15, 8:10 pm, "Bruce Remick" wrote:


"Reality" wrote in message


....


What is the deal with this nonsense?


When I submit a coin to PCGS, I want to know if it is genuine, the
grade, and if it is original.


IMO if you are paying the supposed leading expert graders in the
industry a $30 grading fee plus shipping both ways, then their
"Genuine - Questionable Color" B.S is not an option. I'm paying them
to tell me one way or the other.


The color/toning is either ORIGINAL or NOT.


If they can't tell the difference, then what is their opinion worth?
IMO the grading fee should be refunded if their "experts" can't
discern the difference. It's a total ripoff otherwise.


Tell 'em we said to give you your money back. It's much less stressful to
buy coins already graded by PCGS (and paid for by someone else) than to
send
them your own coins and hold your breath waiting.


The point is, why should *anyone* get ripped off in that manner?
===========


If you do some homework first, you're less likely to get "ripped off".
Sending a coin to a TPG like PCGS can be a crapshoot unless you're someone
who's experienced with that sort of thing. *Before spending that money maybe
it would have saved any disappointment if you'd showed the coin first to a
couple reputable dealers who might have cautioned you about your coin's
questionable color and how PCGS might respond to it. *You didn't say if you
did submit the coin through a dealer or if you're a "member". *If it was
through a dealer, maybe you've got a gripe with that dealer for not advising
you as to what PCGS might conclude.


No one should get ripped off in that manner, and there are many ways to
minimize the chance.- Hide quoted text -


- Show quoted text -


Bruce, your first advice was very adequate (i.e., buy a decent piece,
sightseen, already slabbed); that's not the game the OP wants to play.

oly


I was going to put the coin in an auction raw, and the advice given to
me was to have it slobbed because that's how most people want to buy
them these days. I'm not playing any games, and I don't appreciate
your silly insinuations.
  #9  
Old January 16th 10, 06:53 PM posted to rec.collecting.coins
oly
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 3,111
Default PCGS and Their "Questionable Color" Ripoff

On Jan 16, 12:35*pm, Reality wrote:
On Jan 16, 6:56*am, oly wrote:





On Jan 16, 8:29*am, "Bruce Remick" wrote:


"Reality" wrote in message


....
On Jan 15, 8:10 pm, "Bruce Remick" wrote:


"Reality" wrote in message


...


What is the deal with this nonsense?


When I submit a coin to PCGS, I want to know if it is genuine, the
grade, and if it is original.


IMO if you are paying the supposed leading expert graders in the
industry a $30 grading fee plus shipping both ways, then their
"Genuine - Questionable Color" B.S is not an option. I'm paying them
to tell me one way or the other.


The color/toning is either ORIGINAL or NOT.


If they can't tell the difference, then what is their opinion worth?
IMO the grading fee should be refunded if their "experts" can't
discern the difference. It's a total ripoff otherwise.


Tell 'em we said to give you your money back. It's much less stressful to
buy coins already graded by PCGS (and paid for by someone else) than to
send
them your own coins and hold your breath waiting.


The point is, why should *anyone* get ripped off in that manner?
===========


If you do some homework first, you're less likely to get "ripped off"..
Sending a coin to a TPG like PCGS can be a crapshoot unless you're someone
who's experienced with that sort of thing. *Before spending that money maybe
it would have saved any disappointment if you'd showed the coin first to a
couple reputable dealers who might have cautioned you about your coin's
questionable color and how PCGS might respond to it. *You didn't say if you
did submit the coin through a dealer or if you're a "member". *If it was
through a dealer, maybe you've got a gripe with that dealer for not advising
you as to what PCGS might conclude.


No one should get ripped off in that manner, and there are many ways to
minimize the chance.- Hide quoted text -


- Show quoted text -


Bruce, your first advice was very adequate (i.e., buy a decent piece,
sightseen, already slabbed); that's not the game the OP wants to play.


oly


I was going to put the coin in an auction raw, and the advice given to
me was to have it slobbed because that's how most people want to buy
them these days. *I'm not playing any games, and I don't appreciate
your silly insinuations.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -


Of course you're playing a game. And you're not an insider, which is
why you can't win.

And to boot, you'll have to misrepresent the coin for the rest of the
sales process. Which, obviously you are more than willing to do.

oly
  #10  
Old January 16th 10, 10:51 PM posted to rec.collecting.coins
Michael Benveniste[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 228
Default PCGS and Their "Questionable Color" Ripoff

On Sat, 16 Jan 2010 10:32:42 -0800 (PST), Reality
wrote:

My question is why didn't PCGS just say that their opinion was that
the coin was recolored? (They would be wrong BTW.)


The term "Questionable Color" covers a lot of ground, from chemical
dips through baking.

The problem that PCGS faces is that unlike other "no grade" codes,
it's difficult to prove conclusively that a coin has been recolored,
or recently dipped, or otherwise artificially toned.

Experts can and do disagree on individual items. More than once, I've
seen coins rejected as artificially colored end up in pristine slabs.
In fact, I own one. It's a 1904 Cent that's sleeping peacefully in an
MS-64 Red holder after a sojourn in a body bag. It's been 9 years
since it was slabbed, and so far the coin hasn't developed the
orange-pink color that I'd expect from dipped copper. But there are
also some black spots on the reverse which make me think otherwise.

So think of PCGS's "Questionable Color" no-grade code as saying, "we
won't stick a grade on this coin because we don't want to guarantee
it."

--
Mike Benveniste -- (Clarification Required)
Cogito eggo sum -- I'm thinking toaster waffles for breakfast.
 




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