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Rockola 440 Gripper and Magazine Motor Blowing Fuses



 
 
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  #1  
Old January 17th 12, 01:44 AM posted to alt.collecting.juke-boxes
robert
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Posts: 20
Default Rockola 440 Gripper and Magazine Motor Blowing Fuses

Hey Everyone,

I seem to keep blowing the "1.6 28VDC Mech" fuse within seconds when
the magazine motor or gripper motor-runs.

Because I don't have anymore 1.6A fuses I have been using 1.5A ones. I
realize that this would be more prone to blowing, but there has to be
something wrong here for it to go that quickly.

Would the motors be causing this? How can I check to see if the motors
are okay? When I turn the motors manually via the little knob on the
bottom of them, they turn easily and do not seem gummed up.


Any help would be greatly appreciated.


Thanks,
Robert
  #2  
Old January 17th 12, 02:18 AM posted to alt.collecting.juke-boxes
Rob in NYC[_2_]
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Posts: 103
Default Rockola 440 Gripper and Magazine Motor Blowing Fuses

Robert, all I needed was "Rock-Ola" and "gripper motor" -they are
notorious for developing shorted armature turns. From the early
1950's models, right on through the later 80's. If it is blowing
quickly, that is the cause.

The only other possible cause is that the cam switches are faulty and
causing the motor to overtravel and jam. That will be obvious when
you turn the motor shaft.

Rob/NYC



  #3  
Old January 17th 12, 02:24 AM posted to alt.collecting.juke-boxes
robert
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Posts: 20
Default Rockola 440 Gripper and Magazine Motor Blowing Fuses

On Jan 16, 9:18*pm, Rob in NYC wrote:
Robert, all I needed was "Rock-Ola" and "gripper motor" *-they are
notorious for developing shorted armature turns. *From the early
1950's models, right on through the later 80's. If it is blowing
quickly, that is the cause.

The only other possible cause is that the cam switches are faulty and
causing the motor to overtravel and jam. *That will be obvious when
you turn the motor shaft.

Rob/NYC


Hi Rob. Thanks so much for the reply! Is there a way to fix the
motors? I tested the cam switches and they seemed okay, and I also
aligned them according to the manual. I can always replace them to be
safe.


Robert
  #4  
Old January 17th 12, 09:25 AM posted to alt.collecting.juke-boxes
Rob in NYC[_2_]
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Posts: 103
Default Rockola 440 Gripper and Magazine Motor Blowing Fuses

Robert, motors can be rewound, while that might be the most reliable
route, it may be cheaper to locate a known-good replacement via one of
the ad's in Always Jukin http://www.alwaysjukin.com/ D/L a sample
issue and look over the classifieds -the same sellers are there every
month.

As for the microswitches, if the motor isn't overtravelling and
jamming at either end of it's travel the switches are not the problem.

If you have a meter capable of measuring amps you might hook it up in
series with the fuse, but I'am pretty sure you have the classic
problem of excessive current drain from shorted armature turns.

Rob/NYC

  #5  
Old January 17th 12, 06:29 PM posted to alt.collecting.juke-boxes
John Robertson
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Posts: 832
Default Rockola 440 Gripper and Magazine Motor Blowing Fuses

Rob in NYC wrote:
Robert, motors can be rewound, while that might be the most reliable
route, it may be cheaper to locate a known-good replacement via one of
the ad's in Always Jukin http://www.alwaysjukin.com/ D/L a sample
issue and look over the classifieds -the same sellers are there every
month.

As for the microswitches, if the motor isn't overtravelling and
jamming at either end of it's travel the switches are not the problem.

If you have a meter capable of measuring amps you might hook it up in
series with the fuse, but I'am pretty sure you have the classic
problem of excessive current drain from shorted armature turns.

Rob/NYC


The gripper assembly may be gummed up too. This will cause the motor to
draw more current than normal.

Turning the gripper motor shaft with your fingers should operate the
gripper bow through the entire cycle - picking up and replacing records
- without feeling like it is jamming up.

The gripper arm should feel slightly loose when resting, and the record
pin should feel snappy when it is picking up the record (at rest is is
solid). The gripper arm should drop when released not go slowly down
(indicating gummed up oil/grease).

Info on taking the assembly apart is he

http://flippers.com/Rockola-tips.html

John :-#)#

--
(Please post followups or tech enquiries to the newsgroup)
John's Jukes Ltd. 2343 Main St., Vancouver, BC, Canada V5T 3C9
Call (604)872-5757 or Fax 872-2010 (Pinballs, Jukes, Video Games)
www.flippers.com
"Old pinballers never die, they just flip out."
  #6  
Old January 17th 12, 08:11 PM posted to alt.collecting.juke-boxes
robert
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Posts: 20
Default Rockola 440 Gripper and Magazine Motor Blowing Fuses

Thanks John,

I cleaned the outside of the mechanism but have no idea as to what it
looks like inside. I'll take a look at that as well but I would think
that if the motor is easy to turn using the armature knob it wouldn't
be gummed up.


Robert

The gripper assembly may be gummed up too. This will cause the motor to
draw more current than normal.

Turning the gripper motor shaft with your fingers should operate the
gripper bow through the entire cycle - picking up and replacing records
- without feeling like it is jamming up.

The gripper arm should feel slightly loose when resting, and the record
pin should feel snappy when it is picking up the record (at rest is is
solid). The gripper arm should drop when released not go slowly down
(indicating gummed up oil/grease).

Info on taking the assembly apart is he

http://flippers.com/Rockola-tips.html

John :-#)#

--
* * (Please post followups or tech enquiries to the newsgroup)
* John's Jukes Ltd. 2343 Main St., Vancouver, BC, Canada V5T 3C9
* Call (604)872-5757 or Fax 872-2010 (Pinballs, Jukes, Video Games)
* * * * * * * * * * *www.flippers.com
* * * *"Old pinballers never die, they just flip out."- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -


  #7  
Old January 17th 12, 08:06 PM posted to alt.collecting.juke-boxes
robert
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Posts: 20
Default Rockola 440 Gripper and Magazine Motor Blowing Fuses

Thanks for the advice Rob.

I'll take a look at the ads and see if I can find the them. In the
meantume, I'm going to try taking them apart and clean them out and
see what that does. I've read that people have had success with doing
that. Either motor, gripper or magazine blow the fuse. It's just kind
of odd that BOTH motors could fail at the same time.


Robert


On Jan 17, 4:25*am, Rob in NYC wrote:
Robert, motors can be rewound, while that might be the most reliable
route, it may be cheaper to locate a known-good replacement via one of
the ad's in Always Jukinhttp://www.alwaysjukin.com/* D/L a sample
issue and look over the classifieds -the same sellers are there every
month.

As for the microswitches, if the motor isn't overtravelling and
jamming at either end of it's travel the switches are not the problem.

If you have a meter capable of measuring amps you might hook it up in
series with the fuse, but I'am pretty sure you have the classic
problem of excessive current drain from shorted armature turns.

Rob/NYC


  #8  
Old January 18th 12, 07:06 AM posted to alt.collecting.juke-boxes
Rob in NYC[_2_]
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Posts: 103
Default Rockola 440 Gripper and Magazine Motor Blowing Fuses

Robert, while having two defective motors may seem odd. The fact is
that they were both made by the same maker and frankly, cheaply, in
keeping with Rock-Ola's policy of simple machines that didn't cost a
lot.

The circuit involved is very simple: unfiltered DC feeding two brush
motors one at a time. If you can access a meter to actually read the
amps being consumed that will show what is going on.

It wouldn't hurt to open the motors and clean out all the carbon from
the brushes and use a small stiff brush to 'comb' out carbon from the
individual commutator segments (the steps the brushes ride on) but I
doubt that will make any significant difference.

Almost every R-O phono that I found had a larger fuse in the motor
supply and the reason as I repeatedly found was failing motors.

Sorry to be the bearer of bad news but, there are plenty of motors
around.

Rob/NYC










I'll take a look at the ads and see if I can find the them. *In the
meantume, I'm going to try taking them apart and clean them out and
see what that does. *I've read that people have had success with doing
that. *Either motor, gripper or magazine blow the fuse. It's just kind
of odd that BOTH motors could fail at the same time.

Robert

  #9  
Old October 1st 14, 10:53 PM posted to alt.collecting.juke-boxes
[email protected]
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Posts: 7
Default Rockola 440 Gripper and Magazine Motor Blowing Fuses

Appreciate all the discussion here as I've gotten an old 484 working and all greased up but it too blows the motor fuse (I already jumped the lower-amp circuit breaker). Based on the info in this post, I wanted to see how many amps are actually being drawn so I hooked my own supply to each. One was fine but the one that lifts and replaces the record was pegging the needle on the supply. I can turn it with my hand pretty easy. Well... I kept lifting the record and putting it back by reversing the polarity. Well... after about 20 times, the amp meter showed under 1.? I think that reversing the polarity caused all the charged dust in the motor to re-situate. I couldn't believe my eyes (and didn't). So I have a fuse in right now as I type and I've listened to a bunch of records with no trouble. --the fuse WAS blowing within 2 records. Note that I did NOT remove and clean the motor as the author in this thread did. I may actually try taking the jumper off of the circuit breaker.
  #10  
Old October 1st 14, 11:48 PM posted to alt.collecting.juke-boxes
John Robertson
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Posts: 832
Default Rockola 440 Gripper and Magazine Motor Blowing Fuses

On 10/01/2014, 2:53 PM, wrote:
Appreciate all the discussion here as I've gotten an old 484 working and all greased up but it too blows the motor fuse (I already jumped the lower-amp circuit breaker). Based on the info in this post, I wanted to see how many amps are actually being drawn so I hooked my own supply to each. One was fine but the one that lifts and replaces the record was pegging the needle on the supply. I can turn it with my hand pretty easy. Well... I kept lifting the record and putting it back by reversing the polarity. Well... after about 20 times, the amp meter showed under 1.? I think that reversing the polarity caused all the charged dust in the motor to re-situate. I couldn't believe my eyes (and didn't). So I have a fuse in right now as I type and I've listened to a bunch of records with no trouble. --the fuse WAS blowing within 2 records. Note that I did NOT remove and clean the motor as the author in this thread did. I may actually try taking the jumper off of the circuit breaker.


You really do have to take the armature out and clean between the
commutator plates. Carbon builds up over time and shorts out windings
drawing too much current and blowing fuses...

John :-#)#

--
(Please post followups or tech inquiries to the newsgroup)
John's Jukes Ltd. 2343 Main St., Vancouver, BC, Canada V5T 3C9
(604)872-5757 or Fax 872-2010 (Pinballs, Jukes, Video Games)
www.flippers.com
"Old pinballers never die, they just flip out."
 




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