Borders, Books in Print, Amazon

I found out recently that Borders will order used books for people,
so I tried out their service. First I went to Amazon and found out
what prices I could get on 2 used books. Then I went to Borders
and asked about the availability of those same books. Apparently,
Borders only accesses the database of its own books and the database
of Books in Print, which to my surprise does include books that are
not in print. Borders was unable to locate the first of the two books
I asked about. It could locate the second one used but only at a price
of over $100, whereas the same book was available used from Amazon for
$15 plus S&H.

This raises lots of questions:
(1) Why does Books in Print lists used books that are out of print?
(2) Why does Books in Print list some used books but not others?
(3) How does a particular used book wind up in the Books in Print data base?
(4) I've noticed for some time that there are some used books listed by
Amazon at rather exorbitant prices, sometimes more than the list price,
even when the book is still in print. Now I'm wondering: are the
vendors are comfortable doing so because they know that the book will
turn up in Books in Print's database and that cheaper ones won't be seen
by people who primarily use Books in Print, e.g. Borders customers?
--
Ignorantly,
Allan Adler
* Disclaimer: I am a guest and *not* a member of the MIT CSAIL. My actions and
* comments do not reflect in any way on MIT. Also, I am nowhere near Boston.

Allan Adler wrote:
:
(1) Why does Books in Print lists used books that are out of print?
I believe Books in Print lists those books which publishers represent
to be in print. Publishers would have no idea whether someone is
offering used copies of their books. It would appear that you have
some mistaken assumption, and perhaps that assumption was provided to
to you by a bookseller who did not exactly know what was what..
(2) Why does Books in Print list some used books but not others?
See the answer to (1), above.
(3) How does a particular used book wind up in the Books in Print data base?
I do not have access to the Books in Print data base, so I will not
even suppose that your retail bookseller is operating solely from
information provided by Books in Print.
(4) I've noticed for some time that there are some used books listed by
Amazon at rather exorbitant prices, sometimes more than the list price,
even when the book is still in print. Now I'm wondering: are the
vendors are comfortable doing so because they know that the book will
turn up in Books in Print's database and that cheaper ones won't be seen
by people who primarily use Books in Print, e.g. Borders customers?
Amazon lists books that are offered, through their listings, by
individuals or businesses. Pricing of used books tends to be highly
individualistic and is not necessarily intended to conform to the
market prices suggested by other booksellers.

Incidentally, I once went to the Harvard Coop to order a book which was
not the current edition but was nevertheless listed in Books in Print.
This was a firm order and I put down cash for it. After several weeks
I went back to ask how it was coming. The publisher did not fulfill
the order and I bought the book several years later for fifty cents,
rather than twenty-five dollars, at a library book sale. It was still
useful to me.

David Ames

Interesting. I probably buy 2-3 books a week, plus an equivalent
number of CDs and DVDs. Never had a problem

Denton



On Sat, 29 Jul 2006 11:26:27 -0700, "Amazon Steals"
wrote:

I don't think Amazon is going to be around much longer. Their stock is
going to bottom out. The last two orders I placed through them were taking
3 and 4 months respectively. I had to cancel both of them and order the
items through other vendors. They refunded my money on the first order, but
am still waiting on my refund from the second order. It has now been 1 1/2
months since requesting the refund from the second order and after promising
to send the refund within 10 business days, they are now non-responsive
except for saying "we are researching your refund sir".
I'm preparing to file a mail fraud case with the Attorney General's
office in Olympia.
I've done thousands of dollars in business with them since 1998, but
Amazon has gone to hell in the last year, ever since going into partnership
with too many vendors, and not enough employees to make sure the orders in a
timely manner, and now not even to provide customers with a refund when they
can't deliver the goods.

I don't think Amazon is going to be around much longer. Their stock is
going to bottom out. The last two orders I placed through them were taking
3 and 4 months respectively. I had to cancel both of them and order the
items through other vendors. They refunded my money on the first order, but
am still waiting on my refund from the second order. It has now been 1 1/2
months since requesting the refund from the second order and after promising
to send the refund within 10 business days, they are now non-responsive
except for saying "we are researching your refund sir".
I'm preparing to file a mail fraud case with the Attorney General's
office in Olympia.
I've done thousands of dollars in business with them since 1998, but
Amazon has gone to hell in the last year, ever since going into partnership
with too many vendors, and not enough employees to make sure the orders in a
timely manner, and now not even to provide customers with a refund when they
can't deliver the goods.

Amazon Steals wrote:
They refunded my money on the first order, but
am still waiting on my refund from the second order. It has now been 1 1/2
months since requesting the refund from the second order and after promising
to send the refund within 10 business days, they are now non-responsive
except for saying "we are researching your refund sir".

You seem to be under the misconception that you are dealing with one
entity on these orders when in fact you are probably dealing with
different marketplace sellers who are not Amazon themselves.

If you are out of pocket and cant get a refund why havent you made an
A-z claim with Amazon who would get you the money back from the
marketplace seller within about a week. All this information is easily
available on the Amazon website so I dont understand your problem?
Also, you will find that when you open a buyers account with Amazon you
agree to their terms and conditions which you are now questioning? I
suppose you never bothered to read what you were signing?

"Amazon Steals" wrote in message
...

I just sent an email to Jeff Bezos personally. That is my last ditch
effort to deal with Amazon on the matter before pursuing more drastic
action.

Such as Amazon taking you for every last penny you own in libel
damages, and putting you out on the street ?

Yup ! That sure sounds like a real smart move to me as well.

Troll over.


michael adams

....

Amazon Steals wrote:
I don't think Amazon is going to be around much longer.

I would tend to disagree.

Their stock is
going to bottom out. The last two orders I placed through them were taking
3 and 4 months respectively. I had to cancel both of them and order the
items through other vendors. They refunded my money on the first order, but
am still waiting on my refund from the second order. It has now been 1 1/2
months since requesting the refund from the second order and after promising
to send the refund within 10 business days, they are now non-responsive
except for saying "we are researching your refund sir".

That doesn't seem to fit the definition of non-responsive.
Non-responsive would be not answering at all, unless you're a lawyer.

I'm preparing to file a mail fraud case with the Attorney General's
office in Olympia.

OK.

I've done thousands of dollars in business with them since 1998, but
Amazon has gone to hell in the last year, ever since going into partnership
with too many vendors, and not enough employees to make sure the orders in a
timely manner, and now not even to provide customers with a refund when they
can't deliver the goods.

With all due respect, yours seems like an isolated case. Further, I
suspect you are posting in bad faith.

I just sent an email to Jeff Bezos personally. That is my last ditch effort
to deal with Amazon on the matter before pursuing more drastic action.
Hopefully you'll continue to have better luck than I have with my last two
orders.

Interesting. I probably buy 2-3 books a week, plus an equivalent
number of CDs and DVDs. Never had a problem

Denton



On Sat, 29 Jul 2006 11:26:27 -0700, "Amazon Steals"
wrote:

I don't think Amazon is going to be around much longer. Their stock is
going to bottom out. The last two orders I placed through them were
taking
3 and 4 months respectively. I had to cancel both of them and order the
items through other vendors. They refunded my money on the first order,
but
am still waiting on my refund from the second order. It has now been 1
1/2
months since requesting the refund from the second order and after
promising
to send the refund within 10 business days, they are now non-responsive
except for saying "we are researching your refund sir".
I'm preparing to file a mail fraud case with the Attorney General's
office in Olympia.
I've done thousands of dollars in business with them since 1998, but
Amazon has gone to hell in the last year, ever since going into
partnership
with too many vendors, and not enough employees to make sure the orders
in a
timely manner, and now not even to provide customers with a refund when
they
can't deliver the goods.

"Amazon Steals" wrote in message
.. .
Such as Amazon taking you for every last penny you own in libel damages,
and putting you out on the street ?

I'm ready to send a packet to the Washington state AG office. You don't
file libel against someone who tells the truth, is in the right and has
mounds of evidence to back up their claim.

You've collected mounds of evidence for "how much" in damages?

Kris
The longer the story.......

You seem to be under the misconception that you are dealing with one entity
on these orders when in fact you are probably dealing with different
marketplace sellers who are not Amazon themselves.

All of the items were listed on the order page as being sold by Amazon.com.
This is not a "merchandise return". This is an order cancellation for
non-delivery of six separate brand new store items. This is one order, all
under the same order number. The order was placed on March 17. The check
was written to Amazon.com. and mailed. Amazon cashed the check in mid-May.
As of June 22 none of the merchandise had been delivered, so the order was
canceled. The order summary page has listed the refund check status as
"processing" since June 22 and the only response by customer service to my
queries by email and phone over the past couple of weeks is "we are
researching this for you", but no one ever does respond with an answer as to
the results of their "research".

If you are out of pocket and cant get a refund why havent you made an A-z
claim with Amazon who would get you the money back from the marketplace
seller within about a week.

The items weren't ordered from third party sellers. And the merchandise was
never delivered to begin with. Hypothetical: What if someone ordered a
dozen items from 12 different sellers and none of the items were ever
shipped? Are you telling me that the poor buyer would have to file a claim
with 12 different sellers for non-delivery of merchandise and request 12
different refunds while Amazon sits on their ass and doesn't even act as a
liaison? Did you know that Amazon clears the entire order summary page at
their site when there is a refund request due to non-delivery of
merchandise? So you had damn well better have a copy of your order saved in
your computer or a printed hardcopy, otherwise you are screwed. All they
list after a refund request is the refund status at the bottom of the page
and any items from the order that were already delivered.

Also, you will find that when you open a buyers account with Amazon you
agree to their terms and conditions which you are now questioning? I
suppose you never bothered to read what you were signing?

Not sure what you mean by "signing". You mean checkmarking a box?
Based upon my recent experience, I would say that this probably isn't an
isolated case of poor customer service and I would be selling all of my
Amazon stock as quickly as possible. They've apparently overextended
themselves with the recent deals they've made with vendors and don't have
enough employees to fill large orders in a timely manner. If I don't get a
response from Jeff Bezos, then I'll be contacting Jim McKenna at the AG
office in Olympia.