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? "Jorg Lueke" ?????? ??? ??????
news On Mon, 27 Sep 2004 19:31:48 -0400, Padraic Brown wrote: On Mon, 27 Sep 2004 21:48:28 +0300, "gogu" wrote: Sarkozy made his comments after French Prime Minister Jean-Pierre Raffarin voiced misgivings on Thursday about Turkey joining the bloc, asking if Europe really wanted "the river of Islam to enter the riverbed of secularism." Hah! France is practiacally a Muslim country, when compared to other large EU countries! They ought to get along with Turkish membership like a house afire! Padraic. I think it would be wonderful if Turkey were to eventually join. The EU would certainly have a moderating influence on the more egregious Turkish policies and help stabilize a secular Islamic state. Over time, perhaps, we could even see a Mediterranean addendum to the EU with peaceful, democratic, stable Islamic and Christian countries joined together. :-)))))))))))))))) Seriously now, I *do* want to see a democratic Turkey joining EU. That would mean that Turkey has reached a high democratic level, which is nice! The problem is how long it will take for the Turkish society/political class to reach that level... After that, I'd be glad to see them in EU. That's about in 25-50 years from now. -- http://gogu.enosi.org/index.html http://www.romclub.4t.com/rabin.html E' mai possibile, oh porco di un cane, che le avventure in codesto reame debban risolversi tutte con grandi puttane! F.d.A |
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#22
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On Tue, 28 Sep 2004 23:59:49 +0300, gogu wrote:
Seriously now, I *do* want to see a democratic Turkey joining EU. That would mean that Turkey has reached a high democratic level, which is nice! The problem is how long it will take for the Turkish society/political class to reach that level... After that, I'd be glad to see them in EU. That's about in 25-50 years from now. The exat speed at which Turkey would join would not be as important as long as the country was headed in that direction. In other words making progress. I wish we would do the same in the WTO. I'd much prefer to trade with a country like India than China. Especially with no mechanism to measure/force any changes. And an ecenomic carrot will always be preferable to the alternative. |
#23
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? "Jorg Lueke" ?????? ??? ??????
news On Tue, 28 Sep 2004 23:59:49 +0300, gogu wrote: Seriously now, I *do* want to see a democratic Turkey joining EU. That would mean that Turkey has reached a high democratic level, which is nice! The problem is how long it will take for the Turkish society/political class to reach that level... After that, I'd be glad to see them in EU. That's about in 25-50 years from now. The exat speed at which Turkey would join would not be as important as long as the country was headed in that direction. In other words making progress. This is true and I am very happy for that ! I wish we would do the same in the WTO. I'd much prefer to trade with a country like India than China. Well, no objection here, but why ? Especially with no mechanism to measure/force any changes. I see. I think that soon we will see great changes there. But let's be careful: not always changes are good! A small story to make my point clear: when I was (much) younger, I was a little "rebel" like all the young people :-) My father was always conservative and anti-communist. He used to blame the commie regimes that they have no freedom and as an example he was saying that their citizens could not travel freely abroad! I still remember that I was saying "be afraid if they are left free to come her" ;-) He was objecting, and so on... Years have passed, year 1989 came, the Iron Curtain was dismantled and ... thousands of "easterners" came in my country... Criminality has raised, unemployment, etc... At that point I asked my father if he still remembers what I said to him some time ago... And for the *first* time in his life that proud man who *never* accepted that he did/said something wrong, accepted that in this case he was wrong! What I want to say is that *maybe* a completely free China is not a so good idea... Nothing racist here, just simple economics. -- http://gogu.enosi.org/index.html http://www.romclub.4t.com/rabin.html E' mai possibile, oh porco di un cane, che le avventure in codesto reame debban risolversi tutte con grandi puttane! F.d.A And an ecenomic carrot will always be preferable to the alternative. |
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