WQMA 1520 AM RADIO 8-TRACK LIVE SHOW- TODAY- 1-4 PM !

On 20 Aug 2005 06:03:11 -0700, wrote:

I am pretty sure radio carts were not 4 track, but rather 2-track. snip

Sort of. Mono broadcast carts are single audio track and a skinny cue
track, while stereo machines are two audio tracks and a skinny cue
track.

The
cart itself was nearly identical to a 4-track cart, but they did not
have individual programs. Just two tracks, one right/one left, or even
just one track if it was a mono cart, which many of the older ones
were. snip

Not. All broadcast carts are single "program" and run at 7½ IPS. The
carts, however, are directly compatible with 4 track machines, as a
rule.

My station actually used them for music as well as spots, and our engineer
had fined tuned the carts and machines so precisely that they sounded
like honest-to-God reel-to-reel. snip

Most stations used carts for music. By about 1970s, playing
polystyrene 45s on the air was obsolete.

dB

Back in the day, there were three sizes of radio cart. There was the
"8-Track" sized cart, and there were two other larger sizes (I don't
remember the dimensions.) The larger ones were used for things like
department store muzak, or sometimes on radio for long looping
programs. When I started in radio we had old cart players that were
adaptable to the larger sized tapes, but I have never actually held one
of the larger carts.

On 20 Aug 2005 08:01:24 -0700, wrote:

Back in the day, there were three sizes of radio cart. There was the
"8-Track" sized cart, and there were two other larger sizes (I don't
remember the dimensions.) The larger ones were used for things like
department store muzak, or sometimes on radio for long looping
programs. When I started in radio we had old cart players that were
adaptable to the larger sized tapes, but I have never actually held one
of the larger carts. snip

The larger ones are still in service in many locations, provided by
AEG Music Service with their "NoviTone" service. I know, because my
dentist still has this service, but it's slated to be removed and
replaced with a full digital system. AEG sends them a new cartridge
every so often. The system provides music of four different programs,
switchable with a button, to each chair. On this system, the head
doesn't move...all switching is done electronically to the output of
each chair. The airlines also used this same cartridge, after the
less-than-reliable Viking (later Telex) "carousel" thing didn't work
out too well.

How does the system sound? Ummm...not that good! The usual foibles
of the skinny tracks at slow speed are instantly identifiable.

Some of the bigger Spotmaster broadcast player/recorders had a wide
slot and a lever that would be used to widen the guides for use with
the bigger carts. These are not the same as the "background music"
service carts; they have no captive pinch roller and are compatible
with the Fidelipac broadcast system. In this case, they ran at 7½ IPS
and used the usual broadcast 2 or 3 track format. Many syndicated
programs that a station would subscribe to could be ordered either in
7" open reel or in "supercart" format. The only subscription program
I remember that showed up in 10½" reels was the Casey Kasem "Billboard
Countdown" program distributed by Westwood One, and that ran at 15 IPS
as an option. Most subscribers took it in the usual 7"/7½ IPS format,
but this one FM station I did work for was pretty conscientious about
quality, and the results were audibly noticeable. It's a shame there
are no "good" broadcasters anymore...now, it's all corporate crap.

dB

There was a local funeral parlor here about 10 miles away- they just
sold their Telex 8-track changer on Ebay last winter- they used it to
play funeral music during the wake and funeral services at the parlor.

There was a local funeral parlor here about 10 miles away- they just
sold their Telex 8-track changer on Ebay last winter- they used it to
play funeral music during the wake and funeral services at the parlor.

That's right...I forgot about the cue track. I was right in the
assertion that they had one or two tracks of actual audio, though.

My experience was that the carts were mechanically compatible with
4-tracks, but the tracks were noit aligned in the same fashion.

As for the use of carts in lieu of vinyl...actually, my experience was
that it was about 50/50. Some stations stuck to carts, some stuck to
45s. A lot of it had to do with the preference of the engineer in
charge, or the program director. Also had a lot to do with what
equipment the station had and what comparative quality either type of
equipment was. My station played every format at once...cart, vinyl,
CD, even cassettes on rare occasions. We played such a wide variety of
music that we took it any way we could get it. Often we would bring in
our personal records and record them to carts. All of our machines were
of the same relative quality and accessability, because our engineer
had a love affair with the station so he kept us sounding great. From
what I saw, most smaller stations operated that way. Larger stations
were more likely to have a uniform system. Among radio DJs, any station
that used carts for music was considered cheap...it was thought of as
more professional to have vinyl or CDs for music, reel (or cassette)
for long programs, and carts for spots/bumpers/liners/beds only. Mind
you, this was in the old days. Then came computer audio...such as
Prophet and AudioVault...when every respectable radio DJ said "to hell
with this, I am going to go get a real job."

There were also a few syndicated shows that were available on
LP...FLASHBACK with Bill St. James was one.

We had small college stations playing LP's on a regular basis here,
into the early 1980's- they'd drop the needle and play the entire sides
of rock LP's just like playing them at home. It was great to hear all
of Pink Floyd Wish You Were Here, etc. on the radio- but these were
typically night time shows from 8 or 9 pm on.

This 8-track show revealed just what I thought it would- the 8-tracks
they played had a fuller sound than their hard drive stored digital
music.

On 20 Aug 2005 20:47:37 -0700, wrote:


As for the use of carts in lieu of vinyl...actually, my experience was
that it was about 50/50. Some stations stuck to carts, some stuck to
45s. snip

Among radio DJs, any station
that used carts for music was considered cheap...it was thought of as
more professional to have vinyl or CDs for music, reel (or cassette)
for long programs, and carts for spots/bumpers/liners/beds only. Mind
you, this was in the old days. Then came computer audio...such as
Prophet and AudioVault...when every respectable radio DJ said "to hell
with this, I am going to go get a real job." snip

Some recollections:

Many stations went to carts because the abuse that those polystyrene
45s would take on from those Gates and Rek-O-Kut "record destroyers"
tracking at 10 grams on a cheap Stanton cartridge and mishandling by
the DJs themselves. Both of these would quickly make them unfit for
airplay. RKO-General, at KHJ and KHJ-FM (later KRTH) in Los Angeles
went to carts around 1968 (?) just for that reason...DJs would mangle
the promo 45s, and then, if it got bad enough, the PD would have to
try to weasel a clean copy out of whoever was the promoter for that
label

It should be noted that airplay promos were always a different mix
than the storebought or jukebox copies, as they were pre-compressed,
thus making the station sound "louder", on top of any compression the
chief engineer would add, so most PDs wouldn't allow (nor did the
labels want) storebought 45s or LP cuts spun on-air. So, the regimen
became to get the 45s in from the promoters, figure the playlist, and
then dub everything to cart right away, and then put the carts into
rotation. The Drake-Chenault system was a heavy Top 40 rotation
system, and thus the various carts were color coded with an adhesive
dot, and a "program wheel" of these various colors showed the DJ which
order to play them in. It didn't really matter which came in what
order; the PD would divide all records into classifications and, for
instance, ballads would be purple, hot rockers would be red, more MOR
vocals would be green, and so on. This was pretty standard in all
heavy rotation stations in that era.

Polystyrene 45s were about the worst sounding and least well lasting
of the modern disc media, so putting them all on cart and playing them
on a Spotmaster made a lot of sense. For college/public/third market
radio, though many guys would like to spin vinyl direct, since there
would be less of an investment in carts and production time in
producing them for airplay.

There were also a few syndicated shows that were available on
LP...FLASHBACK with Bill St. James was one. snip

Fairly rare. Most syndicated programming came on tape. Syndication
disc are collectable today and weren't even offered by many of the
syndicators. They were a throwback to the old days when all
"pre-recorded programming" came on 16" 33.3 RPM vertically modulated
transcription discs.

Ah, those were good ol' days. Radio sure sucks now.

dB

You are talking about top 40, of course. AOR stations almost ALWAYS
used LPs. But then, little of what they played would have been on 45s
in the first place...

You are right about the Gates machines. They were tanks, and with
normal care would outlast a Chevy truck...but they ate records alive.
Especially the ones with the wood tonearms. I always preferred the
Technics turntables, based solely on ease of use.

Another reason smaller stations preferred spinning vinyl as opposed to
carts was that it took more work for an engineer to fine tune a cart
machine and a collection of carts (most engineers would get you FIRED
if they found out you somehow brought in "outside carts" and played
them on the station's machines) than it was for them to do the same on
a turntable. Since many stations employ contract engineers who were not
there all the time that was the way they preferred it.

FLASHBACK was the only show I ever saw on LP. I wish I had kept
them...I am sure some butthead I'm-the-next-howard-stern teenager has
come along since I left the station and stolen them or thrown them out
by now...same goes for all of my old jingle reels...

And yes, radio sucks now. In every respect. Jason and Jennifer sound
like they have a good thing going at WQMA...but I can assure you that
is the exception rather than the norm. Radio is going to slowly fade
into the sunset over the next few years, and not really so much because
the medium itself is obsolete (which it is in some ways and is not in
others), but because those in charge of it are "changing with the
times" in ALL THE WRONG WAYS. It is stations like WQMA, who do
something interesting, that might actually have a chance. I won't be
sorry to see corporate radio go, because quite honestly there are a lot
of guys at the top who will be put out of work when it finally dies who
really don't deserve to have jobs in the first place.

I'm not bitter. Honestly.

8-Track, on the other hand, will no more die than Elvis or Buddy Holly
died.

radio will stick around for some time- as long as there is AM talk
radio- which has a large following

radio as a music medium- still a good way to get music while commuting
in a car- that market will be there until there is no more oil left

i.e. at least 100 more years and then some