Amanda Pays FA!!!

it really just goes into the whole "ttm people" where they stick up for
their items that they got in the mail and keep their eyes turned when
it's mentioned that the item may not be authentic...like the whole "in
person dealers say the ttm's are fake so they can keep making money."
that's totally untrue, because we already know that you're not buying..
but i just think it's on the seller to say "this was obtained through
the mail." if you don't put that on the item, you are misleading the
buyer...it's that simple...that was really the basis for my argument...
in person dealers who are not selling bad items stae when and where
something was signed if they have that information. the next are the
dealers who don't know and say "we get these at all the permieres,
sporting events and restaurants, so we know what we are doing." those
people don't obtain a damn thing (excuse my french) cause, if they did,
they would tell you where they got it..that simple..
next are the people that say "this is a signed photo of the star
listed, we offer COA with all our items."
and that's what this item is...
there are many of unscrupulous people out there in EVERY BUSINESS...not
just this one. but at least try to distance yourself by not being one
of the bad ones and doing what it right...
when you sell a tv set, do you scratch the name off the tv so people
don't know what brand it is?

and to sue...as always, a COA is only as good as the person backing
it...so in a way, you are correct...but at least when i (or many of the
good buys) sell an item, it's backed by something...i'm responsible for
every item i sell...i don't hide behind fake names and do loopy
things...(regardless of what some people say here, who don't put their
name behind an accusation and disappear when the flames get real
thick)..every item i sell is worth a COA..you can have your
opinions..but bottom line, MOST celebrites don't do private signings or
sign at shows etc...in fact, the people that do, 91% of the time (or
more), they are no longer celebrities and are looking head first at
taking a job at Target or Wal Mart as a host saying "thanks for coming
to Wal- Mart" while handing you a cart. which is most of the star wars
people. it's a whole lot of people who chose not to work any longer and
just do shows...that's their job or they'd be doing just what i said
they would be doing. but kiefer sutherland isn't doing some signing at
a chiller theater show...not yet. and for the time being, the only
autographs available on the market (unless there's some signed card set
i don't know about) come from people like me...so you have to take the
good with the bad...talk about saying things that can only be taken one
way...
mike

GAWD....

my head is spinning; I keep having dejavu, my opinion gets more
solidified, and I think I am going to vomit.

PS Since you are not from the ttm world, you have no right to comments
about these things; especially when you do not know about private
signings and the like. If you are living in that world, you will
become more experienced about it. I don't proport to know how it is
stalking celebrities at Premieres and chasing down cars, so you should
leave this area alone.

On 4 Dec 2006 22:03:00 -0800, "barefoot"
wrote:

it really just goes into the whole "ttm people" where they stick up for
their items that they got in the mail and keep their eyes turned when
it's mentioned that the item may not be authentic...like the whole "in
person dealers say the ttm's are fake so they can keep making money."
that's totally untrue, because we already know that you're not buying..
but i just think it's on the seller to say "this was obtained through
the mail." if you don't put that on the item, you are misleading the
buyer...it's that simple...that was really the basis for my argument...
in person dealers who are not selling bad items stae when and where
something was signed if they have that information. the next are the
dealers who don't know and say "we get these at all the permieres,
sporting events and restaurants, so we know what we are doing." those
people don't obtain a damn thing (excuse my french) cause, if they did,
they would tell you where they got it..that simple..
next are the people that say "this is a signed photo of the star
listed, we offer COA with all our items."
and that's what this item is...
there are many of unscrupulous people out there in EVERY BUSINESS...not
just this one. but at least try to distance yourself by not being one
of the bad ones and doing what it right...
when you sell a tv set, do you scratch the name off the tv so people
don't know what brand it is?

and to sue...as always, a COA is only as good as the person backing
it...so in a way, you are correct...but at least when i (or many of the
good buys) sell an item, it's backed by something...i'm responsible for
every item i sell...i don't hide behind fake names and do loopy
things...(regardless of what some people say here, who don't put their
name behind an accusation and disappear when the flames get real
thick)..every item i sell is worth a COA..you can have your
opinions..but bottom line, MOST celebrites don't do private signings or
sign at shows etc...in fact, the people that do, 91% of the time (or
more), they are no longer celebrities and are looking head first at
taking a job at Target or Wal Mart as a host saying "thanks for coming
to Wal- Mart" while handing you a cart. which is most of the star wars
people. it's a whole lot of people who chose not to work any longer and
just do shows...that's their job or they'd be doing just what i said
they would be doing. but kiefer sutherland isn't doing some signing at
a chiller theater show...not yet. and for the time being, the only
autographs available on the market (unless there's some signed card set
i don't know about) come from people like me...so you have to take the
good with the bad...talk about saying things that can only be taken one
way...
mike

i DO PRIVATE SIGNINGS...
where in the world is your head that you believe that what i said
solidified your opinion...wow, i'm not going to respond when it's
obviously YOU that is hard headed...
you make all these claims about what i should do, then you turn around
and do the exact same thing...
NO REAL CELEBRITES DO PRIVATE SIGNINGS (except brandon routh- superman)
it just doesn't happen...i'm not in any way claiming that i am the only
person you can trust, but my COA is worth more weight than a person
doing a private signing..
one of the biggest busts for forgery have been from a guy who did do
private signings...had the pics of brett favre in his house doing the
signings, signing jerseys, mini helmets, helmets and footballs...but he
wasn't making enough money, so he was making his own items too...the
fbi did a sting on him and got brett favre involved and told him not to
sign cetain images, to which brett refused those items during the
signing..but in the guy's advertisement, he had those photos signed and
he was busted...the guy had all the proof in the world, including his
canceled checks from brett...and he was busted for forgery...so even
your private signings don't go without being fradulent...
there's been stories for years that larry bird didn't sign half the
stuff upper deck authenticated sent to him because they didn't have a
representative in the room and supposedly larry's brother did the
signing (i can't back that story up, it could be just a story)but i do
know that it's true that UDA used to just send stuff to their
contracted celebrities and didn't have a rep in the room when the items
were signed...so anything's truly possible...

your opinion was only backed up in your mind...i may not know anything
ttm, but i still stand by my 90% claim. i'll bet lindsey lohan got more
fan mail this year than all the people on this group alone, and no one
is getting an autograph from her in the mail...my 90% claim stands up
pretty well in real autograph circles- maybe not this one- and i didn't
make it up off the top of my head.
i may not call myself an expert, but someone like me, who has watched
THOUSANDS of people sign their name and can actually detect signature
patterns, is more likely to be able to spot a fake before someone who's
only autograph experience is TTM and the occassional chiller theater
show and or a few concerts from has been bands at the local county fair
(and no, i'm not calling you names)... but there is NOTHING in my last
post that solidifies anything that you've stated..i guess when yours is
the only opinion you consider, that everything is going to seem like it
backs your opinion up. that brett favre thing proves that you can't
even trust private signings...that guy had a great relationship with
brett, brett gave him tickets to games, got him on the field, got him
access to other players for other signings...(i'm not dare saying that
wattographs or officialpix are doing this, but at the same time, you
can never be too sure.)
mike


Sue H wrote:
GAWD....

my head is spinning; I keep having dejavu, my opinion gets more
solidified, and I think I am going to vomit.

PS Since you are not from the ttm world, you have no right to comments
about these things; especially when you do not know about private
signings and the like. If you are living in that world, you will
become more experienced about it. I don't proport to know how it is
stalking celebrities at Premieres and chasing down cars, so you should
leave this area alone.

On 4 Dec 2006 22:03:00 -0800, "barefoot"
wrote:

it really just goes into the whole "ttm people" where they stick up for
their items that they got in the mail and keep their eyes turned when
it's mentioned that the item may not be authentic...like the whole "in
person dealers say the ttm's are fake so they can keep making money."
that's totally untrue, because we already know that you're not buying..
but i just think it's on the seller to say "this was obtained through
the mail." if you don't put that on the item, you are misleading the
buyer...it's that simple...that was really the basis for my argument...
in person dealers who are not selling bad items stae when and where
something was signed if they have that information. the next are the
dealers who don't know and say "we get these at all the permieres,
sporting events and restaurants, so we know what we are doing." those
people don't obtain a damn thing (excuse my french) cause, if they did,
they would tell you where they got it..that simple..
next are the people that say "this is a signed photo of the star
listed, we offer COA with all our items."
and that's what this item is...
there are many of unscrupulous people out there in EVERY BUSINESS...not
just this one. but at least try to distance yourself by not being one
of the bad ones and doing what it right...
when you sell a tv set, do you scratch the name off the tv so people
don't know what brand it is?

and to sue...as always, a COA is only as good as the person backing
it...so in a way, you are correct...but at least when i (or many of the
good buys) sell an item, it's backed by something...i'm responsible for
every item i sell...i don't hide behind fake names and do loopy
things...(regardless of what some people say here, who don't put their
name behind an accusation and disappear when the flames get real
thick)..every item i sell is worth a COA..you can have your
opinions..but bottom line, MOST celebrites don't do private signings or
sign at shows etc...in fact, the people that do, 91% of the time (or
more), they are no longer celebrities and are looking head first at
taking a job at Target or Wal Mart as a host saying "thanks for coming
to Wal- Mart" while handing you a cart. which is most of the star wars
people. it's a whole lot of people who chose not to work any longer and
just do shows...that's their job or they'd be doing just what i said
they would be doing. but kiefer sutherland isn't doing some signing at
a chiller theater show...not yet. and for the time being, the only
autographs available on the market (unless there's some signed card set
i don't know about) come from people like me...so you have to take the
good with the bad...talk about saying things that can only be taken one
way...
mike

wuh? Doobie woh... egads.

On 5 Dec 2006 11:42:21 -0800, "barefoot"
wrote:

i DO PRIVATE SIGNINGS...
where in the world is your head that you believe that what i said
solidified your opinion...wow, i'm not going to respond when it's
obviously YOU that is hard headed...
you make all these claims about what i should do, then you turn around
and do the exact same thing...
NO REAL CELEBRITES DO PRIVATE SIGNINGS (except brandon routh- superman)
it just doesn't happen...i'm not in any way claiming that i am the only
person you can trust, but my COA is worth more weight than a person
doing a private signing..
one of the biggest busts for forgery have been from a guy who did do
private signings...had the pics of brett favre in his house doing the
signings, signing jerseys, mini helmets, helmets and footballs...but he
wasn't making enough money, so he was making his own items too...the
fbi did a sting on him and got brett favre involved and told him not to
sign cetain images, to which brett refused those items during the
signing..but in the guy's advertisement, he had those photos signed and
he was busted...the guy had all the proof in the world, including his
canceled checks from brett...and he was busted for forgery...so even
your private signings don't go without being fradulent...
there's been stories for years that larry bird didn't sign half the
stuff upper deck authenticated sent to him because they didn't have a
representative in the room and supposedly larry's brother did the
signing (i can't back that story up, it could be just a story)but i do
know that it's true that UDA used to just send stuff to their
contracted celebrities and didn't have a rep in the room when the items
were signed...so anything's truly possible...

your opinion was only backed up in your mind...i may not know anything
ttm, but i still stand by my 90% claim. i'll bet lindsey lohan got more
fan mail this year than all the people on this group alone, and no one
is getting an autograph from her in the mail...my 90% claim stands up
pretty well in real autograph circles- maybe not this one- and i didn't
make it up off the top of my head.
i may not call myself an expert, but someone like me, who has watched
THOUSANDS of people sign their name and can actually detect signature
patterns, is more likely to be able to spot a fake before someone who's
only autograph experience is TTM and the occassional chiller theater
show and or a few concerts from has been bands at the local county fair
(and no, i'm not calling you names)... but there is NOTHING in my last
post that solidifies anything that you've stated..i guess when yours is
the only opinion you consider, that everything is going to seem like it
backs your opinion up. that brett favre thing proves that you can't
even trust private signings...that guy had a great relationship with
brett, brett gave him tickets to games, got him on the field, got him
access to other players for other signings...(i'm not dare saying that
wattographs or officialpix are doing this, but at the same time, you
can never be too sure.)
mike


Sue H wrote:
GAWD....

my head is spinning; I keep having dejavu, my opinion gets more
solidified, and I think I am going to vomit.

PS Since you are not from the ttm world, you have no right to comments
about these things; especially when you do not know about private
signings and the like. If you are living in that world, you will
become more experienced about it. I don't proport to know how it is
stalking celebrities at Premieres and chasing down cars, so you should
leave this area alone.

On 4 Dec 2006 22:03:00 -0800, "barefoot"
wrote:

it really just goes into the whole "ttm people" where they stick up for
their items that they got in the mail and keep their eyes turned when
it's mentioned that the item may not be authentic...like the whole "in
person dealers say the ttm's are fake so they can keep making money."
that's totally untrue, because we already know that you're not buying..
but i just think it's on the seller to say "this was obtained through
the mail." if you don't put that on the item, you are misleading the
buyer...it's that simple...that was really the basis for my argument...
in person dealers who are not selling bad items stae when and where
something was signed if they have that information. the next are the
dealers who don't know and say "we get these at all the permieres,
sporting events and restaurants, so we know what we are doing." those
people don't obtain a damn thing (excuse my french) cause, if they did,
they would tell you where they got it..that simple..
next are the people that say "this is a signed photo of the star
listed, we offer COA with all our items."
and that's what this item is...
there are many of unscrupulous people out there in EVERY BUSINESS...not
just this one. but at least try to distance yourself by not being one
of the bad ones and doing what it right...
when you sell a tv set, do you scratch the name off the tv so people
don't know what brand it is?

and to sue...as always, a COA is only as good as the person backing
it...so in a way, you are correct...but at least when i (or many of the
good buys) sell an item, it's backed by something...i'm responsible for
every item i sell...i don't hide behind fake names and do loopy
things...(regardless of what some people say here, who don't put their
name behind an accusation and disappear when the flames get real
thick)..every item i sell is worth a COA..you can have your
opinions..but bottom line, MOST celebrites don't do private signings or
sign at shows etc...in fact, the people that do, 91% of the time (or
more), they are no longer celebrities and are looking head first at
taking a job at Target or Wal Mart as a host saying "thanks for coming
to Wal- Mart" while handing you a cart. which is most of the star wars
people. it's a whole lot of people who chose not to work any longer and
just do shows...that's their job or they'd be doing just what i said
they would be doing. but kiefer sutherland isn't doing some signing at
a chiller theater show...not yet. and for the time being, the only
autographs available on the market (unless there's some signed card set
i don't know about) come from people like me...so you have to take the
good with the bad...talk about saying things that can only be taken one
way...
mike

of course..that's always the reply when someone else knows far more
than you do..i'm really not trying to beat you down...but this (and
many others)..you've formed your opinion and stuck to it, and started a
fight when you thought they were wrong and you were right...i guess you
just argue till you're right...
it's ok, lots of people do it...
but seriously, as much as you are trying to help people out, it seems
the only real expertice you have is star wars autographs, and i've seen
stuff on your site (and commented on it) that they aren't real, far
from it...and you got all them TTM...so even you don't seem to know TTM
signatures..why, because YOU CAN'T AUTHENTICATE TTM signatures...it's
just that simple...you can point out blatant forgeries...but you can't
say anything TTM is legit simply because there was no one there to
witness the signing...i've done private signings and been involved in
several, and helped other people with theirs over the years...and
although everything looks pretty much the same from a celebrity's hand,
you can't be too sure about those either...i'm sure the brett favre
thing isn't the only instance...it was a pretty big deal when it
happend and the guy went to jail for 3 years...but shoot, mark mcgwire
got sued by a guy because he said some autograph in a store was
fake...and then the guy sued him because he got it himself...AND WON...
how in the world can mark mcgwire not know his own signature??? i can
go on all day about how in person is the only way you can be sure that
something is authentic...but if all you do is do signings and get stuff
from signings, you'll never have any real movie stars in your
collection...

no; that was my response to reading like the first couple sentences,
stopped reading it because it's long, repetitive, same old same old...
so I am like "nope, not gonna do it" in my best churchlady voice! LOL

PS I didn're read more than the first half of the first sentence of
this either. I'll just let you keep on keepin; on; your comments like
the first half of the first sentence alone makes everyone here
entertained I am sure.

On 5 Dec 2006 12:33:20 -0800, "barefoot"
wrote:

of course..that's always the reply when someone else knows far more
than you do..i'm really not trying to beat you down...but this (and
many others)..you've formed your opinion and stuck to it, and started a
fight when you thought they were wrong and you were right...i guess you
just argue till you're right...
it's ok, lots of people do it...
but seriously, as much as you are trying to help people out, it seems
the only real expertice you have is star wars autographs, and i've seen
stuff on your site (and commented on it) that they aren't real, far
from it...and you got all them TTM...so even you don't seem to know TTM
signatures..why, because YOU CAN'T AUTHENTICATE TTM signatures...it's
just that simple...you can point out blatant forgeries...but you can't
say anything TTM is legit simply because there was no one there to
witness the signing...i've done private signings and been involved in
several, and helped other people with theirs over the years...and
although everything looks pretty much the same from a celebrity's hand,
you can't be too sure about those either...i'm sure the brett favre
thing isn't the only instance...it was a pretty big deal when it
happend and the guy went to jail for 3 years...but shoot, mark mcgwire
got sued by a guy because he said some autograph in a store was
fake...and then the guy sued him because he got it himself...AND WON...
how in the world can mark mcgwire not know his own signature??? i can
go on all day about how in person is the only way you can be sure that
something is authentic...but if all you do is do signings and get stuff
from signings, you'll never have any real movie stars in your
collection...

Ding-Ding...

The bell sounds.

All I can say-I know my TTM Tom Wopat I sent in c/o glenn gary glennross,
matches my in person Tom Wopat. amazing...

I'm just amazed no "Real Celebrities" will do private signings. I thought
all celebrities, were real people....I guess BF is referring to someone like
Harrison Ford being a "Real Celebrity"...

I don't know what he's talking about. We were talking about databases
and next thing you know, he brings up the subject of ttm again without
anyone mentioning it... just to cause headaches.

On Tue, 05 Dec 2006 22:21:42 GMT, "pe2" wrote:

Ding-Ding...

The bell sounds.

All I can say-I know my TTM Tom Wopat I sent in c/o glenn gary glennross,
matches my in person Tom Wopat. amazing...

I'm just amazed no "Real Celebrities" will do private signings. I thought
all celebrities, were real people....I guess BF is referring to someone like
Harrison Ford being a "Real Celebrity"...

no, we are talking about giving a COA to a TTM signature..there is
nothing here about a database...

and harrison ford isn't doing private signings...that's just a rumor
and has never happened.
mike

What is a COA?
It is a certification saying an autograph is authentic.
And, if it is deemed to be not authentic... What happens?
The certifier should have to refund the $.
So, what a COA means is that an in-person guy believes his signature
will be authenticated by so-called experts like PSA/DNA or whoever else
it is these days.
Barefoot, you are right and wrong. While it is impossible to be 100%
certain about TTM signatures, it is also impossible for an
authenticator to be 100% certain about ANY autograph.
It is possible for an in-person guy to certify an autograph as 100%
authentic, but impossible for a non-present 3rd party to do so beyond a
shadow of a doubt.
Bottom line is all of it is a scam.
On to private signings... Again, the same rules apply. I think I can
guesstimate whether an item is good or not, but it is my opinion. I
could believe something is real that isn't. Does that make it any more
or less real in my eyes? No.
I guess what I am trying to say is that you are both right and both
wrong. There is no way to authenticate anything without 100% proof.
Be it a video camera or a photo that shows the pen on the photo and
more than 1/2 of the signature.
There is no other way!